Podcast
5-4
5-4 is a podcast about how much the Supreme Court sucks. Hosted by Peter Shamshiri, Rhiannon Hamam, and Michael Liroff, it's a progressive and occasionally profane take on the ideological battles at the heart of the Court's most important landmark cases and an irreverent tour of all the ways in which the law is shaped by politics.
Subscribe to our premium episodes & much more at fivefourpod.com/support
5-4 is a production of Prologue Projects.
- Government chart
- #5
- Episodes
- 335
- Releases
- Weekly
- Typical length
- 46 min
- On air since
- 2020
- Latest episode
- 19 hours ago
Episodes
335 episodes, newest first
-
5 min
Movie Review: The Devil’s Advocate [TEASER]
Show notes
Are lawyers literally the devil? Is toe sucking satanic? Have you voted yet?
Thank you to our wonderful subscribers!
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at fivefourpod.com/support.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
40 min
Minersville School District v. Gobitis
Show notes
The Supreme Court rules you have to say the pledge in school…and three years later, takes it back.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this episode ad-free and listen to Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at fivefourpod.com/support.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
49 min
The Vindictive Prosecution of Ilhan Omar
Show notes
On Monday, October 12th federal agents raided Representative Ilhan Omar’s home as part of an investigation aiming to denaturalize and deport her. This is really disgusting.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this episode ad-free and listen to Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
46 min
Department of Homeland Security v. D.V.D. (and Rhoney v. Barbosa de Cunha)
Show notes
Deporting people to dangerous countries? Detaining them indefinitely without bond? Bad, actually.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this episode ad-free and listen to Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at fivefourpod.com/support.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
5 min
250 Years of Bad Decisions Pt. 2: The Law Was Never Neutral [TEASER]
Show notes
In honor of America’s birthday, join Peter, Rhiannon, and Michael for part two of their Supreme Court retrospective. This time they track how the myth of judicial neutrality has haunted America for centuries.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at fivefourpod.com/support.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
43 min
De-Supremify the Supreme Court with Niko Bowie and Daphna Renan
Show notes
Do we have to accept the Supreme Court as the final arbiter of constitutional meaning? Legal scholars Niko Bowie and Daphne Renan say no! They join the podcast to talk about their new book, Supremacy: How Rule by the Court Replaced Government by the People, which argues against “judicial supremacy” and looks to America’s past to recover a more democratic constitutional tradition.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this episode ad-free and listen to Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
46 min
2026-2027 Supreme Court Term Preview
Show notes
It’s fall and you know what that means: a chill is in the air and in Sam Alito’s heart.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this episode ad-free and listen to Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
57 min
The Innocence Case from Hell with Josie Duffy Rice
Show notes
Friend of the pod Josie Duffy Rice joins Peter and Michael to talk about her new podcast, The Backfire Effect. Her show digs into the case of Temujin Kensu, a man sentenced to life in prison for the murder of Scott Macklem. Has the wrong man been in prison this whole time?
Listen to The Backfire Effect wherever you get your podcasts.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this episode ad-free and listen to Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
53 min
National Park Service v. National Trust for Historic Preservation
Show notes
We have to let the President build a ninety thousand square feet of ballroom.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this episode ad-free and listen to Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5-4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Alli Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations. Transcriptions of each episode are available at http://fivefourpod.com
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
5 min
John Roberts is on Substack, U.S. Attorneys are Fake, and the DNC is a Scam [TEASER]
Show notes
Peter, Rhiannon, and Michael dig into some recent headlines including plans to ban halal food in Texas, John Roberts’ Substack debut, the disturbing truth behind DNC spam texts, and more.
Check out Adam Bonica’s investigation here.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5-4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Alli Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations. Transcriptions of each episode are available at http://fivefourpod.com
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
38 min
NRSC v. FEC
Show notes
Yet another opinion where the Supreme Court decides that money is speech and bribery doesn’t exist without a big sack of money.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5-4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Andrew Parsons. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations. Transcriptions of each episode are available at fivefourpod.com
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
57 min
Trump v. Slaughter (and Trump v. Cook)
Show notes
Executive agencies are fake by the way…
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5-4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Alli Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations. Transcriptions of each episode are available at fivefourpod.com
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
5 min
Gambling Away the Future: Kalshi, SCOTUSBlog, and Trump’s Bet on the Midterms [SUBSCRIBER-ONLY]
Show notes
Peter, Rhiannon, and Michael take a break from case law to discuss the possibility of stolen midterms, the evil lawyers defending Kalshi and Polymarket, and SCOTUSBlog’s subtle conservative makeover.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5-4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Alli Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations. Transcriptions of each episode are available at http://fivefourpod.com
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
55 min
Mullin v. Doe
Show notes
It’s not racist to think, act, and talk like a racist.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5-4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Alli Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations. Transcriptions of each episode are available at http://fivefourpod.com
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
1 hr 2 min
West Virginia v. B.P.J.
Show notes
The Supreme Court backs West Virginia in banning it's only openly trans student athlete from the girls cross country team.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, get access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
5 min
The Legal Media is Still in Denial [SUBSCRIBER-ONLY] Trailer
Show notes
Peter, Rhiannon, and Michael take a hard look at media coverage of this Supreme Court term.
Thank you to our wonderful subscribers.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers . Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
1 hr 6 min
Trump v. Barbara
Show notes
Birthright citizenship, widely considered settled law before Trump tried to overturn it via executive order last year, escaped this term unscathed by one single vote. Peter, Rhiannon, and Michael explore the various mental illnesses, brainworms, and ahistorical nonsense that led to such a close decision.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5-4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Alli Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations. Transcriptions of each episode are available at fivefourpod.com
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
54 min
250 Years of Bad Decisions: SCOTUS, the Civil War, and the End of Reconstruction
Show notes
In honor of America’s birthday, join Peter, Rhiannon, Michael and University of Pennsylvania Law Professor Kermit Roosevelt as they talk through how the Supreme Court greased the wheels for the end of Reconstruction and the rise of Jim Crow.
Check out Kermit’s book The Nation That Never Was: Reconstructing America’s Story.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
54 min
“The Most Destructive Chief Justice in My Lifetime”: Dissecting John Roberts with Lisa Graves
Show notes
Rhiannon interviews Lisa Graves – right‑wing influence expert, former Justice Department official, co‑host of Legal AF, and founder of True North Research – about her latest book, Without Precedent: How Chief Justice Roberts and His Accomplices Rewrote the Constitution and Dismantled Our Rights.
Check out Without Precedent here!
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
-
41 min
The Supreme Court v. The First Step Act
Show notes
In two cases this term, federal inmates sought their freedom based on compassionate release, an early release process that was expanded under the 2018 First Step Act. The Supreme Court denied both requests.
If you're not a 5-4 Premium member, you're not hearing every episode! To hear this and other Premium-only episodes, access to our Slack community, and more, join at http://fivefourpod.com/support.
5-4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Alli Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations. Transcriptions of each episode are available at http://fivefourpod.com
Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.
Our Sponsors:
* Check out Mint Mobile and use my code mintmobile.com/fivefour for a great deal: https://www.mintmobile.com
* Check out Quince and use my code FIVEFOUR for a great deal: https://www.quince.comAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
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