Circling The Drain

Karen Staley has spent decades on the inside of Nashville’s music business — as a songwriter, performer and background singer — and this week she joins Circling the Drain to tell the stories behind the songs.

Karen takes Johnny Bozeman, Jay Harper and Jim McCarthy back to her early days entering a talent contest at the legendary Wheeling Jamboree, her move to Nashville and the unlikely series of events that eventually put her on the road with Reba McEntire.

She also tells the story behind Tracy Byrd’s “The Keeper of the Stars,” its journey to becoming a number-one hit and ACM Song of the Year, and the unforgettable night George Strait told her he wished she had pitched the song to him.

Karen’s response — at least internally?

“Who do you think we wrote it for?”

We also get into her years around Faith Hill, the realities of being a songwriter versus an artist, how dramatically the economics of songwriting have changed, and why Karen is actually encouraged by some of the young writers and artists making country music today.

It’s funny, candid and packed with stories from an era of Nashville that produced some of country music’s most enduring songs.

Karen Staley on Circling the Drain.

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is sponsored by:
www.crabtreebenefits.com
www.muletownbikes.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

Devon O’Day has been part of Nashville radio, music and entertainment for more than four decades — and she has the stories to prove it.

Devon joins Johnny Bozeman, Jay Harper and Jim McCarthy for a hilarious trip through the glory days of Nashville radio, including her years working with the legendary Gerry House and The House Foundation, what made that show work, and what it was like doing truly live morning radio before there was even a dump button.

She also tells the unlikely story of how “Tennessee Whiskey” songwriter Linda Hargrove helped launch her songwriting career, talks about moving to New York with her sister Faith Ford, and shares how a lifelong love of animals became a major part of her life.

Then the conversation gets more personal.

Devon talks about getting fired, betting on herself and launching Devin’s Farm, as well as sobriety, faith, family and what more than 40 years in Nashville have taught her about starting over.

Plus: Buc-ee’s, old Nashville, Cletus T. Judd, T. Graham Brown, Vin Diesel, bad accents and plenty of radio stories that probably couldn’t happen today.

It’s Nashville storytelling the way we remember it — funny, unpredictable and just a little dangerous.

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is sponsored by:
www.crabtreebenefits.com
www.muletownbikes.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

Circling the Drain is sponsored by:
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Go to www.crabtreebenefits.com to see have David can help you get some time back!

Muletown Bikes - At Muletown Bikes, we believe every bike has a story — and ours goes back over 50 years. Located in the heart of downtown Columbia, Tennessee, our shop carries on a rich tradition of serving local cyclists with passion, knowledge, and a commitment to community.

We are a certified Aventon Ebike dealer and repair shop.

We service all makes and models — whether it’s your child’s first bike, a daily commuter, or a high-performance road machine.

www.muletownbikes.com

Radio used to be the dream. Now some veteran broadcasters are getting shown the door over Zoom — and one of us was recently offered $14 an hour to get back behind the mic.

Welcome to Episode 51 of Circling the Drain.

Johnny Bozeman, Jay Harper and Jim McCarthy take a look at the current state of radio, including the latest round of iHeart layoffs, longtime personalities suddenly finding themselves out of work, the slow disappearance of AM radio and a question nobody in radio used to want to answer:

How much does this business actually PAY anymore?

Plus, the guys look back at the radio they grew up listening to, how Nashville radio has changed, the strange ability broadcasters develop to instantly turn "it on" when the mic opens, and some absolutely unfiltered stories from their own days behind the board.

Including the night Johnny may have fallen asleep while playing Willie Nelson on the radio.

Oh...and Circling the Drain may not be called Circling the Drain much longer.

Apparently inviting an artist onto a show called "Circling the Drain" can occasionally be misunderstood.

Who knew?

Subscribe for more stories from the people who lived through radio, music and entertainment before it all goes down the disposal.

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

Traditional country singer, songwriter, entrepreneur, and Eagleville city councilman Craig Campbell sits down with the Circling the Drain crew to talk about his wild ride from small-town Georgia to Nashville stages and successful coffeehouse-venue brand Grindstone Cowboy.

Craig shares how playing piano in church led to Lower Broadway gigs, touring with Luke Bryan and Tracy Byrd, and eventually landing his first record deal that produced the hit Family Man. He gets honest about financial wake-up calls, label roller coasters, not being allowed to play on his own records, and why he’s now all-in on authenticity, entrepreneurship, and community.

The conversation dives into:
– Growing up in Lyons/Vidalia, GA and finding music through church and gospel
– Working as a correctional officer in a level 5 men’s prison before chasing his Nashville dream
– Cutting his teeth as one of the few piano players on Lower Broadway and singing countless demos
– The story behind Family Man, its music video, and how his family shaped his songwriting
– How a misheard phrase became Grindstone Cowboy, and why COVID pushed him into the coffee/restaurant business
– Trace Adkins helping pack the grand opening and literally working behind the bar
– Serving on Eagleville city council and protecting the town’s growth while growing his own business
– The rapid shift from albums to downloads to streaming, and now AI demos with tools like Suno
– His concerns for musicians in the AI era, but also how broke songwriters can use tech to get ideas off the ground
– New traditional-leaning artists he believes are the real deal, like Zach Top, Jake Worthington, and Ella Langley

If you love real-deal country stories, the hustle behind the music, and the collision of art, business, and technology, this episode is for you.

Timed Highlights / Chapters:

01:33 Rain, racing, and an IndyCar weekend that turned into a three-day saga
02:32 Introducing guest Craig Campbell: traditional country singer and entrepreneur
03:10 Grindstone Cowboy origin: the name comes before the business
03:24 Living in Eagleville and serving on city council
03:56 Running for re-election and using Grindstone Cowboy to collect petition signatures
04:10 How the phrase “Grindstone Cowboy” sparked a coffee shop vision
04:21 COVID wipes out shows and forces a contingency plan
04:21–05:16 Convincing his wife it wasn’t a terrible idea and buying the building in 2021
05:16–06:26 Grand opening madness and Trace Adkins working behind the bar and kissing babies
06:36–07:15 Trace showing up “full Trace Adkins” vs. overalls and cap on this podcast
07:35 The viral “my wife shot me” Trace story that hit nearly 4 million views
08:41 Growing up in Lyons/Vidalia, GA and playing piano in church
08:53–10:07 From correctional officer to honky-tonk band leader and the move to Nashville in 2002
10:15–11:30 Influences: early 90s country boom, Travis Tritt, and being “taught by the best”
11:30–14:13 Lower Broadway grind, playing for Luke Bryan and Tracy Byrd, and finally getting noticed at The Stage
14:13–15:16 Signing his first record deal in 2009 and releasing Family Man in 2010
14:21–15:16 Family Man video: his daughters, wife almost being in it, and one big regret
15:18 Kids, family life, and what really shaped his character
15:20–17:16 Coming to Nashville at 23 to raise his game and avoid plateauing in South Georgia
17:23–18:20 Being one of only a couple piano players on Lower Broadway and working 5–6 nights a week
18:20–19:10 Negotiating his record deal around gig money and demo singing
19:10–21:15 Demo singing, Keith Stegall, Lee Brice, and the song All Night to Get There
21:15–22:23 Singing the demo for Randy Owen’s Braid My Hair and what hundreds of demos taught him
21:25–22:23 True Value Country Showdown: getting the stage bug at 15 and winning local twice
22:20–23:28 Nearly crossing paths with the hosts during the Country Showdown years
23:41–25:31 Success of Family Man, Fish, and then the rude awakening of a single stalling at 38
25:31–27:09 Big tax bills, label closures, and career roller coasters that humbled him
27:15–28:48 Being even-keeled, the serenity prayer, and how his wife’s worrying balances him
28:19–29:10 Aspiring to act and asking Trace Adkins to throw him small roles
29:05–30:34 Dreaming of a Taylor Sheridan role in Yellowstone universe shows like Landman
29:31–31:27 Growing up in a broken home, losing his biological father, and why it didn’t shape his music
31:36–32:31 Stepdad as the real father figure and the inspiration behind Outskirts of Heaven lyrics
32:31–33:15 Learning harmony in church by standing beside his mom and soaking up gospel
33:38–35:00 Teaching himself piano, the old upright he still owns, and eventually plateauing
35:00–36:18 Nashville musicians who can’t read standard notation but dominate the scene
36:20–37:30 Formal vs self-taught: Elton John, Eddie Van Halen, and throwing away the rulebook
37:30–39:11 Imposter syndrome, elite players in Nashville, and still feeling like you belong
39:36–40:33 Getting vibed in studios by musicians and one guitarist he’ll never hire again
40:33–43:12 Studio politics when big-name producers walk in and how attitudes suddenly shift
43:24–45:32 Wounded guitar pickers, radio egos, and people who forget basic courtesy
45:32–48:33 Tanning salons, cell phone stores, bad financial moves, and discovering Eagleville
48:33–52:17 Buying and selling houses around the 2008 crash and landing in a farmhouse with acreage
49:00–51:43 Non-music jobs: correctional officer, maintenance man, sprint phones, tanning, then full-time music
49:19–50:26 Life inside men’s prisons, fights, and the cert team response
52:25–53:12 The unicorn employee problem and realities of restaurant staffing
53:17–54:01 Who actually thrives working at Grindstone Cowboy and why
54:01–56:07 Pay, restaurant economics, and the constant balance of wages vs opportunity
56:16–58:00 Shelbyville location, income realities, ticketed concerts, and selling out Pam Tillis
56:26–56:41 New Grindstone Cowboy being built on 30A in Florida
57:41–59:02 Pitching Eagleville as part of a day-trip route: Arrington, Grindstone, Nearest Green, Jack, Dickel
58:31–59:45 Eagleville’s evolution from a dry town to margaritas at Las Fiestas
59:45–1:01:32 Why he ran for city council and wanting a say in Eagleville’s growth
1:01:32–1:03:16 The wild 10-year shift from albums to downloads to streaming to AI
1:03:26–1:05:14 Suno, AI demos, who it helps, and how it might create “fake songwriters”
1:05:14–1:07:10 Big DSPs creating AI music and placing it atop playlists, and why that scares him
1:06:18–1:07:58 Live shows as the best defense against AI and the importance of human performance
1:07:58–1:10:56 Concert prices, fewer kids seeing legends up close, and the future of live inspiration
1:10:28–1:12:06 New traditional artists he loves: Zach Top, Jake Worthington, Ella Langley
1:11:56–1:13:07 Favorite kinds of gigs: songwriter rounds, theaters, and cranking everything to 11
1:12:06–1:12:36 Playing a 45-minute Ryman set opening for Alan Jackson for colorectal cancer charity
1:13:07–1:14:00 Still releasing music, feeling his voice is better than ever, and keeping his foot on the gas
1:13:56–1:15:32 Wrap-up, where to find Craig and ...

Circling the Drain welcomes brothers Jesse and Noah Bellamy to talk about their new album Sunshine Shop, the Bellamy family legacy, and why the best songs are “imperfectly perfect.” They dive into growing up on a Florida cattle ranch, watching their dad and uncle (the Bellamy Brothers) build a career, and carving out their own sound rooted in harmony, story songs, and live-band energy instead of over-gridded perfection.

The conversation hits everything from AI in music and the future of live performance to Nashville’s changing skyline, vinyl nostalgia, DIY video strategy, and surviving horse-drawn chaos on Broadway. Jesse and Noah also perform two songs live in-studio, showcasing the sibling blend and storytelling that set them apart.

Timed highlights

[00:01:36] Introducing Jesse and Noah Bellamy and their new album Sunshine Shop
[00:02:28] Growing up on a Florida cattle ranch and the real history of American cowboys
[00:03:35] The Bellamy Brothers’ LA era, Let Your Love Flow and returning to Florida/Nashville
[00:05:08] How the brother act formed and why only two of the five brothers play publicly
[00:07:17] Instruments, overdubs and moving from one-man-band recordings to cutting live
[00:08:10] Building a core band, recording Sunshine Shop live and working with Zach Kasik at Wildfeather
[00:09:29] Knowing when a track is “right,” re-cutting I Told a Lie after playing it live
[00:10:49] Recycling and reviving older songs, the idea of a future live album
[00:11:26] Splitting lyrics and melody, trading demos and building a 50-song folder
[00:11:44] Why one of the next tracks has to be a Christmas song, and the video/show domino effect
[00:12:25] Getting into the Christmas spirit in 90-degree weather and George Strait studio stories
[00:12:34] Writing from a young age to avoid cover songs and find their own style
[00:13:40] Songwriting influence from their dad David Bellamy and the Nashville Songwriters Hall of Fame
[00:14:39] Wordsmithing influences from Dylan, Van Morrison, Neil Young, Beatles, Paul Simon, Bob McDill and Don Williams
[00:15:21] Too Dumb for New York City, Too Ugly for L.A. and working with Riders in the Sky on “This Old Cowboys”
[00:16:21] Deep cowboy music history and why Riders in the Sky are the genre’s custodians
[00:17:02] Bringing Tess Frizell in for a duet and the power of second-generation country artists
[00:18:36] Handling comparisons to the Bellamy Brothers and why they want people to come hear their songs
[00:20:09] The Bellamy last name: blessing, curse or both and the rarity of sibling duos today
[00:21:36] The only duo that never broke up and joking about Florida Georgia Line
[00:21:43] Brotherly disagreements, hypothetical fights and thrown instruments
[00:22:49] Setting up to play in-studio and joking about royalty payments and homemade pickles
[00:23:31] Live performance: “Line of Rose” (murder ballad… but not really)
[00:27:10] Reacting to the performance: harmonies, picking and evolving arrangements
[00:27:48] Re-cutting “Line of Rose” from bluegrass to rock for the new record
[00:28:23] Traditional song inspiration from “Rain and Snow” and public domain bluegrass
[00:29:10] “This can’t be happening” moments and Noah getting hit by a horse on Broadway
[00:30:21] Runaway horse, detached carriage and chaos in downtown Nashville
[00:30:36] Click tracks, playing to the grid and why they prefer live band feel
[00:31:15] AI, Suno and fake artists that sound great but aren’t real
[00:31:44] Why live shows and human feel matter even more in an AI era
[00:32:04] Returning full-circle to imperfectly perfect records like Dave Clark Five
[00:33:15] Balancing studio vs live, using the road as a laboratory for songs
[00:34:49] DIY artist reality: limited budgets, choosing between radio campaigns and social media promotion
[00:35:21] Is radio still important and how to split focus between radio, video and streaming
[00:36:11] YouTube vs Spotify, AXS TV support and making iPhone-shot videos with Nita
[00:37:21] Vinyl as a tactile experience, fans buying records as art and mementos
[00:38:24] WMOT, WSM and pockets of Americana and country radio support
[00:38:47] How much more complex promo is now than “just radio and TV”
[00:39:20] Jesse’s Instagram and social strategy and bringing Nita in as a stealth content creator
[00:40:22] Thoughts on social media snippets and giving away song samples on TikTok/Reels
[00:41:02] Discovering Jesse and Noah at Deborah Evans Price’s guitar-pull parties
[00:42:24] The magic of Deborah’s gatherings, gumbo, community and meeting their drummer there
[00:43:51] Artists they listen to now, Megadeth “stealing” their video location and Charlie Rich
[00:45:14] Digging deeper into gospel cuts of “Farther Along” for Deborah Allen’s gospel night
[00:46:18] Franklin Theatre challenges and weeknight ticket realities
[00:46:50] Hair products, beard care and “looks-maxxing” as a musician
[00:47:46] Shooting photo sessions in your 40s and the cigar/beard spokesman jokes
[00:48:49] Touring realities, regional routing and a potential Mexico trip
[00:49:40] Favorite Nashville room: Brown’s Diner, burgers, old beer license and Derby bets
[00:50:58] Soccer, non-sports musicians, marching band and early instrument stories
[00:52:00] From saxophone to drums and finally making peace with being “a drummer, not a musician”
[00:53:22] Motives for becoming a front person and old band war stories
[00:55:00] Songwriter community on Music Row and mostly writing for themselves
[00:55:35] TikTok, trolls and turning “beer, beer, truck, truck, dirt, dirt” into a hit idea
[00:56:28] Why Nashville still works: community, collaboration and creativity
[00:57:00] Austin as a sister city and how both scenes have changed
[00:57:24] Losing historic studios like Sound Shop and the condo-ization of Music Row
[00:58:53] Sunshine Shop cover concept and capturing a building before it disappears
[00:59:42] Nashville skyline then vs now and the Ryman’s near-ruin era
[01:00:02] Seeing metal and shock rock at the Ryman: Anthrax, Alice Cooper and Ted Nugent
[01:01:10] Loudest shows ever and changing approaches to live sound
[01:02:01] From wall-of-amps to silent stages and in-ears: feeling vs hearing
[01:02:26] Alex Van Halen, ear damage and monitor levels creeping up over a tour
[01:02:32] Dream venues: Tampa Theatre, Temple Theater in Portland and more
[01:03:38] New venues: Harkin Hall (Madison) and The Truth (Wedgewood-Houston)
[01:03:53] Live Nation, AEG, Ryman ownership changes and ticket economics
[01:05:06] Wrapping up and defending Nashville’s creative vibe amid rapid growth
[01:05:35] Sunshine Shop plug: why every home should have a copy
[01:06:21] Setting up one more live song to play out the episode
[01:06:40] Live performance: “I Told a Lie”
[01:10:14] Everly Brothers vibes, closing thanks and final Sunshine Shop push
[01:10:39] Where to find Circling the Drain: Facebook, YouTube, circlingthedrain.net and audio platforms
[01:10:48] Where to find Jesse and Noah: website, socials and streaming services

Jesse & Noah: jesseandnoah.com

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Nashville legend, attorney, former councilman and stand-up comic Adam Dred joins Johnny B and J. Harper from Nantucket to talk about everything from politics and scooters to sharks, data centers, cab laws and comedy wars.

Adam walks through his infamous “English-speaking cab drivers” bill, his near-fatal stroke and brain bleed, why he splits time between Nashville and Nantucket, and how he went from radio and stand-up to law and animal advocacy. He also dishes on Trace Adkins, Ralphie May, Steve Harvey, Joe Rogan, Bob Saget, bad Californians in Nashville, and why wind farms and data centers make him crazy.

If you love Nashville, comedy, behind-the-scenes radio stories and unfiltered political takes, this episode is packed.

Timed Highlights (for chapters/clips)

02:13 Life in Nantucket and buying manfromnantucket.com from Russians
03:27 Man From Nantucket merch and fundraising for animal charities
03:49 Bonnie Dred, the toilet-trained cat and viral TV coverage
04:19 Splitting life and law practice between Nantucket and Tennessee
05:09 “Hate months,” gossip season and Nashville heat
05:16 Asking if he can swear on the podcast and political correctness
06:15 Fourth of July “water fight” becomes “water game” and cultural wimpification
06:43 Growing up without helmets, seatbelts and safety culture
07:11 The satirical “prenuptial weight agreement” from law school
07:37 History with Trace Adkins and the “Giant Painters – Ladders Are For Fags” story
09:37 Getting fired for on-air drinking and Lightning 100 “music for angry lesbians”
11:18 How Adam fed the entire TV crew via ad deals and earned loyalty
12:25 Doing good deeds, karma and his Nantucket country radio show “Cohog Wild”
13:05 Declaration of Independence reading controversy and moving it to St. Paul’s
14:30 Making outdoor church services pet friendly and doubling attendance
15:39 From scooters to taxes: why Adam fought Nashville scooters and the economics
16:48 Property tax shock on Lower Broadway and Layla’s honky tonk
19:02 Historic entertainment zoning, Zanies, Douglas Corner and losing venues
19:44 Fighting Eighth Avenue bike lanes and Nashville’s climate reality
20:47 Why free buses beat bike lanes and how Nantucket does transit
21:10 Term limits, “community tithing” and what he did on Metro Council
22:21 Stroke story: blacking out, the crash and coding twice
24:21 Citywide prayer on the air and waking up telling jokes
25:13 Second brain bleed, Coumadin, misdiagnosis and changing genetic markers
28:08 Allergies changing, bee stings and new ticks that can make you allergic to meat
29:07 Great whites, bull sharks, tiger sharks and hammerheads vs humans
31:11 Overfishing, baby sharks at New Smyrna and blaming sport fishing
33:30 Nantucket vs Martha’s Vineyard culture and politics
34:26 Mr. Rogers on Nantucket and the Fred Rogers Award
34:58 Nantucket Clean Team and making kids care about trash
35:21 Nashville’s “ladders on the interstate” vs Nantucket’s paper bags
36:10 Wind farms, broken blades, beach closures and unseen environmental costs
38:30 Data centers by the zoo, water use, contamination and eminent domain problems
40:33 How Nashville bungled the data center permits and legal exposure
41:48 Megan Barry, mayors’ affairs and why Adam still defends her as a person
43:01 Losing children, grief and why some people get a lifelong “hall pass”
43:38 Missing old Nashville: Phasins, the Trace, Maud’s Courtyard and Hillsboro Village
45:15 “Bad Californians,” fake service dogs and a dog-bite lawsuit story
48:38 Payment plans for Bel Meade Californians and serving people by publication
48:50 Jim’s severe dander allergy and workplace pets putting him in the hospital
49:49 Emotional support animals vs real service dogs in law and travel
50:47 Chinese poison pet food case, Phil Valentine’s cat and suing for the owners
52:23 Remembering Bart Durham and what people don’t know about him
53:23 How contingency-fee firms really pick cases
56:16 Abortion question at a forum and Adam’s 16-year “abort your kid” joke
57:51 Musica statue complaints, “I posed for it” and renaming the Christmas tree
58:14 Holiday tree vs Christmas tree, menorah and being born Jewish in that fight
58:52 Circling the Drain as a brand and “circling and stirring”
59:32 When Adam is back in Nashville: Vandy tailgate, tents 1 and 2 and open bar
1:00:09 Pavia, Heisman, image problems and Pacman Jones comparisons
1:01:10 Cheetah 3 strip club in Atlanta and hosting the Battle of the Cheetah Girls
1:02:21 Ralphie May, the divorce, TMZ allegations and the stress that killed him
1:03:56 How Ralphie was treated, money issues and the banned ex-wife
1:04:42 Ralphie’s last phone call and the Vegas shooting
1:05:18 Getting into comedy at Vanderbilt, Rights of Spring and Henry Cho
1:06:10 First road work, a blown radiator and Steve Harvey saving his hand
1:07:06 Co-headlining with Dennis Leary and learning to follow dirty comics
1:07:51 Joe Rogan as his opener and Bob Saget’s filthy sets
1:08:54 Nantucket comedy festivals and his local Nantucket books
1:09:26 Island Cup: Nantucket vs Martha’s Vineyard, whaling roots and big kids
1:10:26 Tuna, sharks, Block Island and fall “shoulder season” on Nantucket
1:11:07 Restaurant Week, chamber duties and being “a man of leisure”
1:11:45 Faith, obligation to give back and leaving the world better
1:12:07 Johnny B calls Adam a hero and they tease live shows from Vandy and the boat
1:12:36 Adam’s legal plug: no-charge consults and 888-DUI-ADAM
1:13:04 Wrap-up, invitation to future episodes and Circling The Drain plugs

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

On this episode of Circling The Drain, Johnny B, Jay Harper and Jim McCarthy sit down with Tanya Montana and Shelli Coe, daughters of outlaw country legend David Allan Coe. They share what it was really like growing up on the road, clear the air about racist allegations and the infamous X‑rated albums, and explain the truth behind the estate, the will, and why the kids aren’t “silver spoon” heirs.

Tanya and Shelli talk about their own musical journeys, the Goodbye Girls Nashville shop, reconnecting with long‑lost siblings, and how their mom Jody quietly held the whole family together. This is one of the most honest, emotional, and human conversations you’ll hear about fame, family, and faith in country music.

Timed Highlights / Chapters:

02:00 – Growing up as Coe kids and Tyler’s guitar chops on the road with Blackberry Smoke
05:01 – Shelli’s Texas roots, Dripping Springs, Willie Nelson’s grandkids and writing songs from childhood
06:25 – The family album, Heavenly Father, Holy Mother and 3‑year‑old Shelli on tape
07:26 – Tanya’s childhood on the road, faxes with her dad and discovering songwriting
09:57 – From accounting to artist: opening Goodbye Girls and being thrown on stage at GG Happy Hour
12:10 – Todd Snider discovers Tanya at the shop and offers to record her for free
13:20 – Silver Bullet: DIY iPhone video, political talk show bumper music and fan reactions
15:06 – Why radio and “Billy Sherrill rules” don’t define modern independent artists
16:07 – Billy Sherrill, David Allan Coe’s genre‑bending catalog and embracing creative risk
17:10 – John Lennon comparisons, Hydro Emotion and the power of All Effed Up
18:17 – Shelli’s song I Need My Name and writing out of love for her dad
20:33 – Making a low‑budget but powerful video in a closed furniture/consignment store
22:13 – Life as kids on the road: band members as protectors and the “Willie Nelson family” vibe
23:59 – Growing up between strict Christian schools and a rough, all‑male tour bus world
25:05 – How the band quietly protected the kids from danger and bad situations
25:21 – The X‑rated albums, racist accusations and what the family actually believes
27:33 – “I love black culture and music”: Tanya on reconciling her dad’s catalog with her values
28:10 – Shelli: “The children of David Allan Coe are not racist” and why she’s never listened to those albums
29:29 – Context for the X‑rated records, parody, Red Foxx, Mel Brooks and intent vs misuse
30:14 – Never giving up: years of unanswered texts, trying to reconnect and the pain of estrangement
33:26 – Going to the funeral scared, public viewing and being “breadcrumbed” through each event
34:41 – Shelli’s impromptu eulogy and thanking the fans for loving their dad
36:19 – David Allan Coe’s traumatic childhood and the side most fans never saw
38:16 – Early 80s Nashville radio memories and meeting David at Spence Manor
39:01 – Playing deep cuts on air: Compass Point, Spectrum 7 and late‑night spins
40:39 – Shelli joins the road in the early 90s, first show in Austin and deciding to be a performer
42:08 – Buses, vans, “carnival” convoys and how the big road show eventually went broke
43:23 – Re‑configuring the bus so the kids could live on the road with their dad
45:03 – Why the kids had relatively “normal” lives thanks to their mothers
45:35 – Jody’s crucial role in the family, fan club and giving all the kids a home base
46:26 – Welcoming a newly discovered brother, Josh, and his family into the fold
47:35 – How the siblings are building a united family now, even without controlling the estate
48:19 – Growing up in East Nashville, Goodbye Girls as a community and the “little shop that could”
50:39 – Surviving 16+ years in retail, COVID, Lana Del Rey’s support and small‑business hustle
52:09 – What Goodbye Girls actually sells: vintage western, stagewear, boots and boho fashion
53:38 – Explaining East Nashville’s vibe and the meaning behind Goodbye Girls
54:04 – Re‑releasing David’s “This Is David Allan Coe” book and why prices spiked after his death
55:20 – What Tanny Montana Music really is and what Jody actually owns
57:00 – Clearing up rumors: Tanya doesn’t get royalties from Stand By Your Man or other songs
58:23 – “We’ve been excluded from everything”: reading the will and dealing with that heartbreak
1:00:17 – The kids’ perspective on narrative wars, online attacks and trying to stay classy
1:01:04 – First time publicly going this deep on the record about the will and estate
1:01:33 – Shout‑out to Tyler Coe’s Cocaine & Rhinestones podcast and the siblings’ admiration
1:02:30 – Where to find their music: Bandcamp, Facebook pages and respecting each sibling’s privacy
1:03:58 – How they’re grieving together and keeping the family unit strong
1:04:36 – Where to find Circling The Drain: Facebook, YouTube, iHeart, Apple Podcasts, TuneIn and merch

Socials / Links
Tanya’s shop:
• Goodbye Girls Nashville – goodbyegirlsnashville.com

Music (Bandcamp):
• Tanya Montana – “Silver Bullet” (vinyl) and “Hydro Emotion” (CD) available on Bandcamp
• Shelli Coe – “A Girl Like Me” available on Bandcamp

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

On this episode of Circling The Drain, Johnny B, Jay Harper, and Jim talk about how political division has seeped into every corner of entertainment and media. They trade stories from talk radio, debate Trump’s influence on patriot events, and unpack why fans are turning on artists who get too political from the stage.

The guys also reminisce about women who changed rock (Linda Ronstadt, Ann and Nancy Wilson, Amy Lee), underrated girl and boy bands, and classic film stars and directors. They hit on the Morgan Wallen and Jason Aldean controversies, the 250th celebration tied to Trump, CMA Fest politics, and how talk radio and cable news are burning people out. It’s part nostalgia, part media critique, and part “can we please just enjoy a show again?”

Includes:
– Behind-the-scenes stories from talk radio and WTN
– How politics hijacked July 4th and the 250th celebration
– Country music’s culture war: Jason Aldean, Morgan Wallen, Beyoncé, CMA/ACM awards
– Why conservative talk radio has become an echo chamber
– Classic crushes and icons: Linda Ronstadt, Bridget Fonda, Cher, Marilyn Monroe
– Film noir, Turner Classic Movies, and Spielberg’s new UFO film
– Trace Adkins, Taylor Sheridan, and dream casting for Yellowstone-style shows

Timed Highlights:
0:00 Lioness, Linus and dad-joke cold open
0:45 Johnny B, Jay, and Jim check in and bust chops on age and birthdays
2:50 Sharing birthdays with Tom Cruise, Andrew Garfield, Demi Lovato, Amy Adams, Scorsese, and Danny DeVito
4:10 Jim’s last-minute save as a baseball PA announcer and learning the lingo on the fly
7:50 Mercy rules, softball vs baseball pace, and why tournament ball can be brutal
8:45 Rush’s new drummer on tour and pulling off Tom Sawyer live
10:15 Blink-182’s drummer, plane crashes, DJ AM, and guilty-pleasure pop bands
12:10 Boy bands, Backstreet Boys, The Bangles, Go-Go’s, and needing more women drummers and guitarists
14:15 Linda Ronstadt, Ann and Nancy Wilson, Amy Lee, and greatest female rock vocalists
15:59 Linda Ronstadt stories, studios in Nashville, and realizing you’ve been sitting next to a legend
19:10 Aging icons: Linda Ronstadt, Cher turning 80, separating politics from performance
21:14 Trump, De Niro, Sean Penn, Johnny Depp and when politics ruins the art
22:38 Trump’s 250th celebration, Martina McBride and Bret Michaels backing out
25:00 Can we have a non-political patriotic event anymore? Remembering the 1976 Bicentennial
29:30 Covid money printing, tariffs, gas prices, and why voters always come back to their wallets
31:00 Bruce Springsteen, the Black Crowes, and crowds telling artists to “shut up and play”
32:10 CMA Fest, Justin Pearson, and bringing politicians on stage to rant
32:58 Music Row’s political disconnect from the country audience
33:37 Morgan Wallen being ignored by awards shows despite massive popularity
33:58 Jason Aldean’s “Try That in a Small Town,” Columbia courthouse, and outrage over the video
34:51 A billion streams, Congressional recognition, and producing the songwriter podcast
35:58 10–15 years of politics dividing entertainment
36:34 Steve Earle, protest songs, and when stage rants kill the vibe
37:10 Dixie Chicks backlash, Natalie Maines, and radio phones melting down
37:50 Playing Dixie Chicks on classic country formats and the name-change wars (Dixie Chicks, Lady A)
38:33 College indoctrination, Jim Breuer’s bit, and “racist, sexist, gender” on repeat
39:40 Campus politics then vs now, old-school professors who actually debated
40:59 Talk radio turning into an echo chamber and worshipping Trump
41:38 Jim getting heat on WTN for criticizing Trump’s spending
42:21 Audience demanding red meat and nothing but politics
44:16 Burnout from politics on air: filling in at WTN and being exhausted by the news cycle
45:18 Fox News running nonstop in the background and how it shapes older viewers
48:54 Family stories: visiting parents and in-laws who live on cable news and Trump
49:53 Streaming instead of news: Turner Classic Movies, film noir, and great writing
50:47 Classic Hollywood glamor, Bogart and Bacall, Marilyn Monroe, and missing wit in modern movies
52:00 Marvel highs and lows after Endgame and Spielberg’s new disclosure/UFO movie
53:23 Emily Blunt, Monty Python references, and “huge tracts of land”
54:02 Whatever happened to Bridget Fonda and why she left Hollywood
55:00 Privacy, health, car accidents, and what aging looks like in the spotlight
57:17 Growing up a Fonda, Hollywood burnout, and punning about “Fond of Fondas”
57:37 Sound drops, Kelsey Grammer’s legendary stage fall, and physical comedy clips
58:15 Trace Adkins’ accident, almost losing a leg, and that unreal voice in headphones
59:44 Deep-voice envy, timbre, and why Trace belongs in a Taylor Sheridan series
1:00:36 IndyCar in Nashville, Alex Palou, short shorts, and being surrounded by race fans
1:02:06 Hospital stories, heart issues, and future guest John with his Muscle Shoals lineage
1:03:26 Why it’s fun but risky to wade into politics on a usually non-political show
1:04:10 Nearing episode 50 and the idea of “drinking before vs after” each podcast
1:05:21 Racing, upcoming events in Nashville, and guests missing the studio driveway
1:08:24 Directions, flagpoles, and the perils of running a hidden hilltop studio
1:09:21 Joking about fans “clogging the drain” and possible spin-off names
1:10:00 Where to find Circling The Drain across platforms and video/audio

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

Country icon Trace Adkins gets candid about buying his Tennessee farm, Nashville’s explosive growth, and why “perfect” modern records leave him cold. He shares wild stories with Merle Haggard, Waylon Jennings, Buck Owens, and more, plus visions for a catfish joint called Hot Mamas.

Trace Adkins is back for part three, and this time he goes deep on life at the farm, Nashville’s real estate explosion, and why old-school, imperfect records still hit harder than today’s polished tracks. From Merle Haggard in boxer shorts with a joint over his ear to Waylon cussing the bugs onstage and Buck Owens’ brutally honest “low note” advice, Trace tells the kind of stories only a true country legend can.

He and the guys also riff on Nashville turning into a “clean New Orleans,” soccer vs. hockey, the changing studio scene, in-ear monitors vs. wedges, health food vs. fried catfish, and his dream of opening a catfish joint called “Hot Mamas.” If you love real country, road stories, and unfiltered opinions, this is your episode.

1:01 How Trace found his dream 100‑acre farm (and paid more later for 30 acres)
2:55 Nashville’s growth, California money, and $3M homes in former farm fields
3:35 “Clean New Orleans” vibes: Broadway, CMA week, and 250 people a day moving in
5:19 Murfreesboro, Franklin, Gallatin: when the outer ring gets just as crowded
6:07 Getting outside 840 to keep “country living” alive
7:26 Little League moms, grocery store encounters, and a fan story gone sideways
8:18 Why Trace hates soccer and loves hockey fights
10:37 Being a Titans fan, the Music City Miracle, and growing up with the Saints
12:20 Nashville before the Titans and Predators: massage parlors, Printer’s Alley, and a ghost town downtown
17:07 What happens to Music Row studios when AI and home recording take over?
18:39 “Too perfect” records vs. real, messy, live music
19:46 Cutting with Asleep at the Wheel high and out of tune – and why that’s exactly what Trace wanted
20:22 Loving rough live albums and records with mistakes and feel
21:54 Old records recorded by eye and cue, not click tracks and grids
22:33 Trace refuses to sing to a click in the studio
23:00 One in‑ear, loud wedges, and missing the days of club monitors ripping his face off
25:08 Country legends: Merle Haggard in boxers, Waylon fighting bugs, and Hall of Fame grudges
29:41 Buck Owens puts Trace through his paces and gives him brutal “low note” advice
33:05 Grand Ole Opry memories and realizing he’s now one of the “old guys” backstage
36:09 Married to a fitness model: salmon, rice, salads… and disastrous squash brownies
38:02 “I pay for premium health insurance so I can eat what I want”
39:30 Bougie Nashville: Sperry’s, Perry’s, Bourbon Steak, truffle and duck‑fat fries
40:46 Organic fast food and shameless restaurant plugs
41:38 Trace’s dream restaurant: a catfish joint called “Hot Mamas” with flirtatious 50‑something waitresses
43:28 Victoria’s “guilt‑free” menu concept and why Trace’s buddies won’t eat there
44:20 Real pizza talk: New York‑style favorites and local spots
45:22 Mafia‑vibe Italian joints, Godfather radio bits, and ticking off the real bosses
46:37 Wrapping up: three hours with Trace, veterans work, 30th anniversary tour, and where to find Circling the Drain

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

In Part 2 of our deep-dive with country icon Trace Adkins, we get the stories behind his most emotional and controversial songs, from “Honky Tonk Badonkadonk” to “You’re Gonna Miss This” and “Arlington.” Trace shares powerful memories from Arlington National Cemetery, his candid take on Donald Trump, and the radio days with Phil Valentine that almost got people fired.

We also dig into his acting career, how he met his wife on a movie set, the wild origin of his dog “Gary Busey,” and why he believes live shows are now the only truly “real” part of the music business.

0:43 – If Trace had to be in a tribute band forever, who would he choose?

1:36 – Waylon Jennings’ “Honky Tonk Heroes” and how it inspired Trace’s “Dangerous Man” album cover

3:25 – The grind of album photo shoots and making a real, gritty cover shot

4:12 – The Phil Valentine show, stepdad life, and getting sick of “Honky Tonk Badonkadonk”

5:44 – Why “Honky Tonk Badonkadonk” is cleverly written, not just a novelty hit

6:42 – How the song became the most-played country song in strip club history

7:44 – The backroom label deals behind certain cuts and how “You’re Gonna Miss This” started as a wedding song

9:00 – “I thought it was too sappy” – Trace misjudges a song that becomes a massive number one

10:26 – Ashley Gorley’s hit-making juggernaut and why everyone wants one of his songs

11:04 – Writing “American Made” for the country’s 250th anniversary

11:38 – “Arlington” and “An Empty Chair” – songs that choke him up on stage

12:04 – Performing “Arlington” at Arlington National Cemetery and barely getting through it

12:43 – Why Trace only does “Arlington” for the right audiences (and never for drunks or festivals)

14:04 – The true story behind “Arlington” and Lance Corporal Patrick Nixon

16:26 – Playing “Arlington” on air, Phil Valentine’s reaction, and the emotional weight of the song

17:04 – Remembering Phil Valentine: sparring on-air, sharp wit, and real friendship

18:34 – A hilarious voicemail from Trace and joking about “your little radio show”

19:22 – Rodeo memories, FCC close calls, and the infamous “hot and juicy” weather report

21:18 – Live radio chaos: open mics, cussing and thinking they’d be fired

22:16 – Trace’s new production company “Fifth Rodeo” and its cowboy-with-a-fifth-of-whiskey logo

23:14 – Why Trace doesn’t want the pressure of doing a podcast

24:07 – From tractors to Lululemon and voiceovers: “degradation” of the conversation

24:19 – “Ultimate Cowboy Showdown,” real cowboys and concern for the horses

25:25 – Why some ranch work still has to be done on horseback

26:08 – Trace’s Christmas show: Celtic vibes, stories behind songs and gospel roots

27:32 – Feeling good about the Christmas show vs. “I’m sorry, Lord” after “Badonkadonk”

28:08 – Is memorizing dialog hard? How years on stage made acting easier

28:58 – Directors who demand word-for-word delivery vs. those who allow improvisation

29:46 – Meeting his wife on the set of “The Virginian” in Vancouver

30:21 – How his wife writes, acts and why their dog is named Gary Busey

31:50 – The Christmas parade, a weird looking puppy and the Gary Busey hair and teeth

32:05 – Writing a song for the 250th and the Freedom 250 concert controversy

32:48 – PBS Fourth of July, Trump’s event, and shifting TV schedules

34:02 – The best Trump impressions Trace has heard and how Trump exaggerated his own persona

35:43 – Riding in Trump’s limo and getting asked: “Are you reasonably faithful to your wife?”

36:55 – Trump Jr. explains his job: “I follow him around and put fires out”

37:42 – Wanting to be Ambassador to Australia or the “Office of Hell No”

38:00 – How Trace judges Trump: “He’s a rich old asshole, not evil”

39:11 – New York real estate, DC politics, and why Trump didn’t need to run

40:00 – Meeting Trump on the plane: funny, warm, and totally different from the public caricature

40:31 – Touring Trump’s penthouse and offices: proud of what he’s built

41:04 – Negotiating through hyperbole: Greenland, Canada, and “shooting for the moon”

42:23 – Dave Chappelle’s take on Trump’s debate moment about tax loopholes

43:07 – Rand Paul vs. Trump on stage and how one debate moment flipped opinions

43:54 – Label history: Capitol, Show Dog, Broken Bow, Verge, and coming back “home” to MCA

45:22 – Why this next MCA album might be Trace’s last

45:32 – New artists he likes (Ella Langley) and why she “has every tool”

46:12 – Betting whether Ella Langley will stay country or go pop

46:42 – Not knowing many of today’s artists and thinking “Shaboozy” was a whiskey brand

47:32 – Loving traditional country and hopes for a pendulum swing (Zach Topp)

47:57 – Advice for new artists in the AI era and why live shows are the last “real” thing

48:54 – Getting fooled by an AI demo and how hard it is to tell what’s real

49:14 – Why you should never spend your own money if people truly believe in you

50:12 – Writing his book with twin collaborators and building the “roller coaster” story

52:33 – Immigration, politics and realizing parts of the book were prophetic

52:53 – Feeling uneasy before release and calling Charlie Daniels for advice

53:55 – Charlie Daniels’ wisdom: “People who don’t like you now aren’t going to read your book”

54:20 – Singing at Charlie Daniels’ funeral and what Charlie meant to him

54:51 – Why he probably didn’t sell enough books to worry in the first place

55:09 – Why there’s no audiobook yet and how a Trace-voiced edition could revive it

56:00 – Ideas for updating the book with new chapters and addendums

56:17 – Tease: Trace Adkins Part 3 is coming to Circling the Drain

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

Country legend Trace Adkins joins Circling the Drain for a raw, funny, and unfiltered conversation about survival, success, and the scars he picked up along the way.

Trace opens up about growing up in small-town Louisiana, singing bass in church, working dangerous oil rigs in the Gulf, getting shot by an ex-wife, flipping a tractor, multiple open-heart surgeries, and why he still prefers hard work on the farm to life on the tour bus. He also talks about his breakout in Nashville, label politics, 30 years in country music, and how acting and voiceover work have kept him relevant.

Along the way you’ll hear wild stories featuring Gene Simmons, Mark Wahlberg, Kurt Russell, Donald Trump, Blake Shelton, and more – plus why the national anthem still makes him nervous every single time.

This is Part 1 of our Trace Adkins series on Circling the Drain.

1:56 – Trace walks in like a superstar and why everyone respects him
2:26 – The only “tangible result” of being on stage: applause and then back to the bus
3:03 – Farm life, physical work, and needing something real to show for the day
3:50 – Taking down massive ash trees and chasing a chainsaw voiceover gig
4:30 – Losing a Steel commercial because he didn’t wear gloves
6:09 – 12+ years as the voice of Firestone and other national campaigns
6:42 – KFC, Farmer Boys, and ongoing work with Wounded Warrior Project
7:30 – Five daughters, Lululemon bills, and the idea of Trace voicing an athleisure brand
8:01 – Intimidating the boyfriends: hunting on his land and the “I could bury you here” moment
9:47 – Telling a boyfriend he “wasn’t going to make it” and helping him cut his losses
10:25 – Five daughters, three ex-wives, and being “five times more confused about women”
11:10 – Growing up in church: singing beside his granddad with that rich bass voice
11:40 – Discovering that “chicks dig the bass” in a gospel quartet at 17
12:43 – Hayrides, jamborees, and covering Haggard and Buck Owens
13:20 – Working offshore on a drilling rig and singing in the wheelhouse after 12-hour shifts
14:08 – Winning the Wild Turkey Battle of the Bands and coming to Nashville
15:00 – Club circuits, drugs, booze, and learning “everything you’re not supposed to do”
16:08 – Getting his first guitar at 10 and taking lessons in Spring Hill, Louisiana
16:42 – Why he calls himself a “lazy guitar player” and just plays enough to accompany himself
17:11 – Cutting off a finger and the chords he can’t play anymore
17:40 – The shooting: getting shot by an ex-wife and why he didn’t press charges
18:52 – Bullet through the heart and both lungs, Life Flight, and Vanderbilt saving his life
19:45 – Bleeding on the floor, protecting the new carpet, and passing out in the atrium
21:04 – Being 32, strong, and why that’s the only reason he survived
21:39 – Scars from construction work, broken arms and legs, ribs, and flipped tractors
23:15 – Tractor roll-over, crushed sternum, and calling a neighbor with a backhoe to save him
24:16 – Trauma surgery vs. scheduled open-heart surgery and the pain difference
25:14 – Why he doesn’t write songs about his craziest life events
26:00 – Capitol Records, meeting Scott Hendricks at baggage claim, and getting offered a deal on stage
27:06 – Being a big, striking presence and coming from a tall family
28:21 – Shrinking from 6'6" to 6'5" and feeling it in the joints
28:52 – Label politics after Scott leaves Capitol and refusing to go back into the building
29:29 – Almost throwing an executive out the window and the Patsy Cline “she’s dead” story
31:02 – New leadership, Mike Dungan, and how Tim DuBois helped push Trace’s career forward
32:17 – The Chrome era, bikes, and typecast biker roles in movies
33:00 – Deepwater Horizon, playing a furious parent, and Peter Berg demanding more intensity
35:30 – Manhandling Mark Wahlberg on set and the behind-the-scenes story
35:59 – Meeting Kurt Russell and seeing oilfield authenticity on screen
36:38 – Why that movie got the oilfield details right
37:01 – Taylor Sheridan, Land Man delays, and writers chasing the next “shiny toy”
38:53 – Yellowstone, spinoffs, and the risk of losing momentum between seasons
40:04 – Getting tricked into a faith-based movie (Mom’s Night Out) and only reading his sides
41:23 – Peeing fire as a demon in a field and calling it his greatest scene ever
49:00 – Gene Simmons on Celebrity Apprentice and how he changed the rules of the game
52:01 – Turning hot dogs into $5,000 donations and reshaping the show around charity money
53:07 – The mysterious “go to my room” invitation and the producer’s warning
53:52 – What Trace really thinks of Gene Simmons and his magnetism
54:08 – His take on Donald Trump and how “what you see is what you get”
54:34 – Why the national anthem still makes him nervous, from car lots to the World Series
55:52 – Respecting the anthem, the range of the song, and starting in the basement
56:47 – Land of the Free as the vocal high point and the challenge of the melody
57:16 – Reading music, Nashville number system, and forgetting trombone days
57:58 – Losing music programs in public schools and why that bothers him
58:17 – Country heroes: George Jones, Merle Haggard, Waylon Jennings, and more
58:48 – Hillbilly Bone with Blake Shelton and why Blake is always chasing the laugh
59:31 – Wrapping Part 1 and teasing more Trace Adkins stories to come

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

Veteran bassist and author Mickey Hayes joins Circling the Drain to pull back the curtain on the wild, brilliant and chaotic world of country legend David Allan Coe. From blacked‑out tour buses and outlaw bikers to wigs, panthers, boats and hit songs, Mickey shares what it was really like to live on the edge with one of country music’s most controversial figures.

Mickey talks about joining Coe’s band in 1979, surviving the Outlaws MC, refitting buses and boats in the Florida Keys, the truth behind the “death row” myth, and why Coe was the PT Barnum of country music. He also dives into Coe’s overlooked Columbia catalog, the making of “The Ride,” working with Warren Haynes, and how those years inspired his book “My Life on the Road with David Allen Coe” and a late‑career songwriting burst.

If you love outlaw country, road stories, and unfiltered music history, this episode is packed with stories you won’t hear anywhere else.

Timed highlights

02:56 Miami club gig and the four‑barrel derringer on the monitor board

04:55 Flying into David Allan Coe’s world and first impressions at the compound

07:04 The purple house, refitting buses and boats, and riding in like a circus

10:16 Swamp-ass on black buses with no A/C and building the outlaw image

13:17 Ad break: Milltown Bikes in Columbia, Tennessee

16:01 Coe’s later years, health, and the line “I just don’t want to die alone”

20:02 Leaving the spotlight, finishing the book, and writing 35–40 new songs

21:38 Playing Coe’s deep cuts, Columbia catalog, and early classic albums

22:18 Rewriting “Stand By Your Man” as “Stand By Your Band”

23:32 The birth of the wigs and why David named one after Mickey

24:57 TV appearances, Farrah Fawcett hair and multiple wigs on Ralph Emery

26:24 Rusty Spur stories, lost wigs and using heartbreak as stage patter

26:55 Earning Coe’s respect by standing up to him over an out‑of‑tune guitar

29:32 Outlaw caravans, smoking and drinking on the road in a fake Packard

33:21 The real story behind Coe’s “death row” legend

34:55 Controversy, X‑rated albums and why Coe welcomed being talked about

41:04 Kris Kristofferson’s advice on songwriting and “Sunday Morning Coming Down”

45:19 Dealing with labels and the infamous record‑exec table story

47:20 Pink Nudie suit, “family” crowd shock and Coe’s onstage antics

50:00 Ruskin Cave, Loretta Lynn tours and getting kicked off the bus route

51:39 Why David Allan Coe belongs in the Country Music Hall of Fame

54:00 Sinking the 50‑foot “pirate” boat and losing everything with no insurance

55:00 Outlaws MC, being hung over a balcony and “you can’t testify if you don’t know”

58:31 Calling Coe a legend and the unmatched volume of songs he wrote

59:54 How Nashville remembers Coe and what happens after you die in this business

1:02:08 Billy Joe Shaver standing up to Waylon and how an album got made

1:07:00 Touring with a black panther, monkeys and other road “pets”

1:11:18 Quitting Coe five times and sending him the tire bill

1:18:00 Austin City Limits, “My Girl,” and how Coe gamed the taping

1:19:49 Mickey on Coe’s legacy, the kids, the widow and posthumous releases

1:20:31 Outro: Where to find Mickey’s book and how to follow the show

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

Sheila Shipley Biddy went from small‑town radio and seven failed interviews to running one of Nashville’s most powerful record labels. In this episode, the first woman to head a major label on Music Row sits down with us to talk about discovering artists, fighting industry sexism, and the stories behind some of country music’s biggest careers.

Sheila shares intimate memories of working with legends like Glen Campbell, Waylon Jennings, Alabama, Roger Miller, Don Williams, Patty Loveless, Gary Allan, and LeAnn Womack. She opens up about fighting for “difficult” artists, taking career gambles, launching Decca Records, and what really changed when Napster, streaming, and 360 deals hit the business.

In the most personal part of the conversation, Sheila reflects on her faith, her work with Music Health Alliance, and surviving the devastating loss of her husband and son within months of each other.

If you care about country music history, radio, or how the record business really works behind the scenes, this is a masterclass in both the business and the humanity of Music Row.

02:21 – Moving to Nashville, small‑town radio roots, and seven Monument Records interviews
05:40 – Turning down TV news and working for less than $100 a month
07:21 – Early days at Monument: Roy Orbison, Larry Gatlin, Ray Stevens, Kris Kristofferson
08:06 – Waylon Jennings, intimidation, and becoming the only rep he’d work with
09:49 – Reading Waylon’s energy and protecting him in public
09:58 – Jumping to RCA and “failing downward” to bet on herself
12:20 – Telling radio the truth about a bad record and earning lifelong trust
14:23 – When that honesty paid off years later at Decca
15:10 – Sexism on Music Row and being mistaken for “the secretary”
17:55 – Mentors, office politics, and being the only woman in the room
20:02 – How Sheila helped bring Alabama to RCA (and why they were first passed on)
22:02 – The phone call that changed Alabama’s life forever
23:47 – Inside Alabama’s rise and balancing Southern imagery and the Confederate flag
26:12 – 50 years in music and how the industry has changed
27:23 – Taking artist failures personally and why she “couldn’t leave it at the office”
28:13 – Fighting three times for Waylon’s “Rose In Paradise” to go No. 1
29:22 – Steve Earle, Lyle Lovett, Nanci Griffith and the risk of “left‑of‑center” country
33:25 – Roger Miller’s “Big River” and selling Broadway to Country radio
36:47 – Working with Glen Campbell and hearing him sing Amazing Grace on an airplane
39:59 – Remembering promotion brothers, early MCA days, and lost friends
41:27 – Becoming the first woman to run a major label in Nashville (Decca)
42:27 – Building Decca from scratch: logo, staff, budget, and vision
45:38 – Dawn Sears, incredible talent, and when an artist doesn’t want it badly enough
48:10 – Discovering Gary Allan in California and why she refused to change his image
49:50 – The album cover where you can’t see Gary Allan’s face (and why that mattered)
49:50 – LeAnn Womack’s showcase strategy and choosing MCA/Decca over “everyone”
51:46 – Why “Never Again, Again” had to be the first single
53:58 – When radio programmers and Alan Jackson fell in love with LeAnn’s album
54:44 – Old‑school radio: when DJs really chose the music and broke artists
55:51 – How small‑market radio and relationships built careers
58:15 – Chasing trends vs. creating trends in country music
59:27 – Roster strategy: male/female, tempo, traditional vs. modern
1:02:09 – From singles deals to full albums and the cost of breaking an artist
1:05:14 – SoundScan, Napster, and watching country sales spike – then slide
1:06:20 – 360 deals, touring, and why tickets are so expensive
1:08:39 – Live Nation, fees, and the squeeze on mid‑level touring acts
1:09:24 – AI, fully AI movies, and the fear inside the creative community
1:09:59 – Life after labels: Music Health Alliance and helping artists get healthcare
1:11:14 – Losing her husband after a long illness and the strength of faith
1:11:44 – Her son’s sudden death at 52 and holding him as he passed
1:13:25 – The Reba McEntire birthday lunch her son never forgot
1:15:01 – Being more than “the label”: real friendships with artists
1:15:24 – Legacy, loss, and why these stories need to be told before they “circle the drain”

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

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https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

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http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

Award-winning artist and multi-instrumentalist Chris Golden joins Johnny B and Jay Harper to swap stories from a lifetime in music. From growing up in the Golden family dynasty (son of Oak Ridge Boys’ William Lee Golden), to playing for every living U.S. president, to singing with his kids and racking up 478,000 miles on the road, this episode is loaded with behind-the-scenes tales, faith, family, and a lot of laughs.

Chris talks about:

– Growing up on the Alabama–Florida line in a deep musical family

– The Oaks’ gospel-to-country transition and backlash from the “church crowd”

– Forming The Goldens and Golden Spear, Muscle Shoals sessions, and label drama

– Playing the White House, One America Appeal, and hanging with multiple presidents

– Touring life, that red sparkle Ludwig snare, and his monster hybrid drum kit

– Voiceover work (Heinz 57, ad auditions, and chasing the “Sam Elliott” spec)

– Recording 34 songs with his dad and brother, and now sharing the stage with his kids

– His upcoming album “A Better Man” and the song “Where My People Are”

03:18 Growing up on the Alabama–Florida state line

07:58 Golden family music roots and Inspirational Country Music Awards

09:56 Rusty Golden, Beatles, Elton John, and brotherly rivalry

10:47 Dad hands Chris a guitar: three chords and “Home on the Range”

13:42 Early bands: Boys Band, Cedar Creek, and Golden Spear

17:19 Muscle Shoals sessions and CBS developmental deal

22:14 The Goldens, label cuts, and touring with William Lee Golden

27:49 Pandemic records: 34 songs with Dad and Rusty, three albums of covers

29:29 Chris’s kids join the show: the next Golden generation

30:48 Opening for Ricky Skaggs with daughter Elizabeth on fiddle

37:14 Glen Campbell, hairspray, and backstage heroes

38:50 Roy Clark, Jim Halsey, and the Oaks’ trip to Russia

41:59 Realizing the family was “extraordinary” and the grind of early Oaks days

47:17 All-night gospel sings: sundown to sunup

53:39 Playing for every living U.S. president at One America Appeal

56:36 The first red sparkle Ludwig snare and why it still matters

1:02:00 Shaking hands with the President at the White House

1:02:38 Drum nerd talk: Chris’s hybrid Pearl/DW/Ludwig/Meinl/Zildjian/Sabian kit

1:06:04 Palace Theatre “family and friends” shows in Gallatin

1:08:21 478,000 miles on the van and the song “Grateful”

1:10:11 Voiceover stories: Heinz 57 campaign and hillbilly reads

1:16:31 New album “A Better Man” and “Where My People Are”

1:17:27 How Chris’s song “Home” helped Johnny B through a rough patch

1:18:26 Where to find Chris Golden and Circling the Drain online

Follow Chris:
https://chrisgolden.net/

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www.circlingthedrain.net

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https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

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Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

Larry Stewart, the voice of Restless Heart and member of The Frontmen, joins Circling The Drain to talk about breaking through in 80s and 90s country, early resistance from Music Row, touring with Alabama, and how one phone call changed his life. Larry shares the origin stories of Restless Heart and The Frontmen, the realities of road life, raising a family while constantly touring, and why today’s country boom feels bigger than ever.

The crew also digs into modern country (Morgan Wallen, Luke Combs, Jelly Roll, Ella Langley), how AI is already reshaping the music business, why live shows are more important than ever, and what it really takes to stay married 40+ years in this industry. If you love 90s country, harmony-driven bands, and real behind-the-scenes stories, this one’s loaded.

02:24 Six straight number ones, becoming “road dogs,” and the Wheels era

03:36 Why radio embraced Restless Heart before the industry did

04:37 How a Belmont kid working at the Country Music Hall of Fame became the lead singer

05:45 Recording the first album, getting married, signing to RCA, and “the rest is history”

08:06 Harmony magic: how five voices created the Restless Heart sound

11:20 Where the songs came from and the role of Tim DuBois and Alabama

12:24 First big tour with Alabama, stage fright, and playing for 15–18,000 a night

14:13 Band chemistry, breakups, reunions, and outlasting most marriages

16:39 Growing up in Kentucky, gospel roots, piano, and choosing music over baseball

20:44 From JUCO ball to Belmont: the crazy path that led Larry to Nashville

25:20 Naming Restless Heart and the terrible band names that didn’t make the cut

25:27 How The Frontmen started with a lobby conversation and a wild idea

26:54 Randy Owen, early Frontmen shows, and taking the act to the troops

28:20 Performing in Iraq, Afghanistan, and on aircraft carriers – bonding through USO-style tours

29:39 COVID shutdowns, livestreaming Fridays at Five, and doubling down on The Frontmen

32:27 Building The Frontmen as a business: LLC, trademark, and brand strategy

33:31 Putting the band together in Nashville and finding the right players

35:46 Modern country: Morgan Wallen, Luke Combs, Jelly Roll, Ella Langley and the 90s influence

37:40 Why country that “hits a nerve” is connecting with massive audiences

38:36 How Restless Heart finally landed on their name (and why “Lazy River Boys” didn’t happen)

41:54 Guilty pleasures, Broadway tunes, Taylor Swift, and not listening to much music anymore

43:01 42 years of marriage, missing family time, and coaching his kids to make up for the road

45:21 Kids, grandkids, and why none of them went into music

48:16 AI, demo singers, and why live music is becoming even more valuable

49:12 Can AI build an artist’s entire image and album from scratch?

51:45 Tracks vs live: how The Frontmen actually run their show

55:13 Where to see The Frontmen live and how Larry stays out of trouble on social media

Follow Larry and The Frontmen:

https://www.larrystewartmusic.com/
https://www.thefrontmenlive.com/

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Follow Jim:

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Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

Johnny B, Jay Harper, and Jim McCarthy dive into how Nashville and Middle Tennessee have changed under the wave of California and out-of-state transplants. From McMansions and roaming dogs to the death of “old” Music Row, they unpack what’s been gained, what’s been lost, and why some newcomers bring their problems with them.

They also hit on the impact of the Telecommunications Act on radio, the shift in the music and movie industries, old money vs new money, the immigrant work ethic, and how social media turned everyone into a political pundit.

If you love Nashville, radio, music history, and a good rant about culture, money, and manners, this one’s for you.

Timed Highlights:

01:17 California and LA “refugees” landing in Tennessee

03:20 From farmland to McMansions: Johnny’s neighborhood transforms

05:13 “The Duttons” move in: roaming dogs, dune buggies, and entitlement

08:05 No-income-tax migration: Texas, Florida, Tennessee and beyond

10:11 Wichita, Montana, Idaho and the new playgrounds for the wealthy

13:13 Voiceover, LA unions, and movie work leaving California

15:27 How unions strangled opportunity in Hollywood

15:53 Remembering “old Nashville” and Music Row’s golden era

17:32 Urban Cowboy, arenas, Predators, Titans and a new city identity

19:02 When Elvis played Murfreesboro and Nashville had no big venue

19:36 The 2010 flood and Nashville’s turning point

21:00 Insurance, healthcare and the real business of Nashville

23:02 “Bringing California food” to Tennessee and why it failed

24:39 Sticker shock: $26 California pizza in Vegas

25:22 Tiny portions, big prices and Southern “meat and three” culture

27:18 Sylvan Park, Monell’s and eating with total strangers

28:55 Nashville gets cosmopolitan – real restaurants arrive

29:18 Bell Meade money, radio paychecks and brutal honesty

32:22 Old money snobbery in New Orleans and Charleston

33:29 Generational wealth: who earns it, who blows it

34:39 Trust fund kids, cash flashes and zero self-awareness

36:58 The Murdoch saga and destroying a family legacy

38:17 Strong men, weak men, good times, bad times

39:19 Immigrant grit, building empires from nothing

40:55 Vietnamese and Cambodian communities thriving in New Orleans

42:02 Cultural distrust and the Vietnamese grocery experience

42:55 California fear in Tennessee vs New York’s evolution

43:33 Johnny’s “John Dutton” neighbor and hoping he’s just unaware

44:05 Dog safety, coyotes and suburban “protection money” jokes

45:00 Southern accents and being stereotyped as dumb

46:25 Facebook community pages, bad spelling and zero punctuation

46:49 Texting culture and the death of proper sentences

47:35 Everyone’s a pundit now: social media, politics and Artemis skeptics

48:04 Wrap-up: Real talk, real idiots, and where to find Circling The Drain

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

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https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

Circling The Drain welcomes artist and storyteller Jared Rogers, with a special guest drop‑in from country legend John Berry. They dive deep into what’s happened to the magic of music: from growing up around Kenny Rogers and Opryland to the harsh reality of streaming payouts, AI “artists,” and the corporatization of radio and Nashville.

Jared shares the story behind his powerful duet with John Berry, “Bridge We All Must Cross,” how faith and real-life struggle shape his writing, and why he’s pushing back against the way DSPs and AI are devaluing human creativity.

If you care about real songs, real musicians, vinyl, radio, and the future of music in an AI world, this one hits home.

2:42 Growing up around the business: Kenny Rogers, Tanya Tucker, Lorrie Morgan, Joe Diffie

3:35 Falling in love with storytelling, songwriting and the stage

3:56 John Berry joins the show from the yard in his work shirt

4:32 How the Jared Rogers & John Berry duet came together

5:41 John on choosing “Bridge We All Must Cross” and first hearing Jared’s songs

7:01 John’s Christmas legacy, “O Holy Night,” and being known for faith-based music

8:18 Jared on running sound for John and why he looks up to him as an artist and believer

9:06 Johnny B’s ’80s Athens, GA story and early John Berry interview

10:13 Life in Athens, UGA fans everywhere, and 38 years of marriage

10:51 Kenny Rogers’ classic weekend: music, sports and a young Jared meeting Michael Jordan

12:56 Studio lessons from John Berry – how legends record vocals

15:08 Kenny Rogers’ “first or second take” magic vs. working the song

16:12 Autism benefit show, calling out a reluctant donor from the stage

17:19 Why charity matters after John’s cancer battle and benefit experience

19:39 Music Health Alliance and the power of community in Nashville

20:31 Robin Berry’s role – harmony, touring and doing life together

22:52 Back to Jared – growing up as Kenny Rogers’ nephew and his dad’s voice

25:27 Inside Jim’s studio: Marvel, Jesus, and the “chop shop” joke

27:04 Jared’s musical influences: BB King, David Gilmour, Bruce Springsteen, Jeff Beck, Van Halen

28:47 Meeting Meat Loaf in Vegas and the best advice he gave Jared

30:17 Radio nostalgia: when DJs, records and MTV made music feel magical

31:23 Jared’s favorite part of the business: building songs in the studio

31:57 The spiritual message behind his album “Sinner Man”

33:00 Writing “Bridge We All Must Cross” at 150 mph and finishing in 20 minutes

34:30 Co-writing with Jerry “Papa Bear” Williams and crafting the track

35:00 Why John Berry was the only choice for the duet

37:05 The reality check: streaming platforms are killing songwriters

39:03 Why Jared loves radio and hates what deregulation did to it

40:42 Vinyl vs downloads – what we lost when music left the jacket and liner notes

44:10 The math of streaming: rich platforms, broke creators

45:14 Why Jared wants off DSPs and back to tangible music

46:32 Remembering the needle on vinyl and the drama of dropping the record

47:09 How Broadway and Nashville lost their soul to high-rises and bars

48:31 AmericanaVille in Livingston – intimate listening rooms vs no traffic

50:00 Today’s country: trucks, whiskey, heartbreak and a few standouts

51:18 Social media grind: crowded, loud and hard to convert to real fans

51:49 A better model: direct-to-artist digital sales that actually pay

53:38 The economics of being a working musician in 2020s America

55:00 Life in the shadow of a famous family name and refusing to be a copy

57:46 Hank Jr. as the example of what happens when you finally become yourself

58:19 Why many new artists are still chasing music radio that’s almost out of gas

59:44 Podcasting as the new radio and a path for artists to own their stories

1:03:36 How AI and synthetic “artists” are flooding the market

1:07:15 Entire AI albums, fake singers and charting “artists” that don’t exist

1:09:44 Faith, revelation and what AI disruption might really mean

1:10:14 Terminator, I Robot and why AI isn’t just sci‑fi anymore

1:13:19 Vinyl outsells CDs again and Gen Z brings records back

1:14:26 Why human imperfection and “off” notes are what make records exciting

1:15:00 Old records with energy: Dave Clark Five, Rare Earth and beyond

1:16:47 World premiere spin: “Bridge We All Must Cross” – Jared Rogers & John Berry

1:17:03 First verse – a troubled mind and the path back to the light

1:17:44 Chorus – the bridge we all must cross and the cross we all must bear

1:18:14 John Berry’s vocal enters – voices blend and lift the hook

1:19:39 Jared on watching legends and staying a student in the studio

Follow Jared and John:
https://www.instagram.com/jaredrogersofficial/
https://www.johnberry.com/

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Follow Jim:

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Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

On this episode of Circling The Drain, the three J’s sit down with Marconi Award–winning talk host and former WTN program director Dan Mandis for a deep dive into his 30+ years in radio.

From cutting his teeth at legendary KFI in Los Angeles with Dr. Laura, to building syndication the hard way, to steering SuperTalk 99.7 WTN through the loss of Phil Valentine, Dan opens up about the highs, lows, and realities of a life behind the mic.

You’ll hear how he:

- Went from board-op and traffic guy in LA to hosting major-market and national shows

- Helped grow Dr. Laura’s show station by station before syndication was “plug-and-play”

- Transitioned from producer to host and program director across LA, New York, Dallas, Fort Wayne, Colorado Springs, Denver, and Nashville

- Dealt with overnights, early mornings, burnout, and moving his family all over the country

- Survived industry cutbacks, never technically got “fired,” and kept landing on his feet

- Navigated the aftermath of Phil Valentine’s passing and kept WTN strong

- Embraced video, editing, and streaming as an “old radio guy” and why he thinks you must if you’re on air today

- Sees podcasting and radio converging and where the next generation of talent will come from

Plus:

- War stories about unscreened open lines on “America at Night”

- A hilariously off-the-rails interview with Van Halen’s former manager Noel Monk

- Dr. Laura’s tough-love style, how she sounds exactly the same today, and what Dan learned from her as a broadcaster and as a human

- A candid look at conservative talk, Rush, Glenn Beck, and how digging into issues changed Dan’s politics

- The power of theater of the mind, why storytelling still wins, and how Morgan Wallen and Ella Langley are doing it in country music today

If you love radio, podcasting, broadcasting history, or just great stories from people who’ve “been there and done that,” this episode is loaded.

Timed highlights (chapter markers):

3:00 Dan’s favorite market: why a smaller station in Fort Wayne was the most fun

4:05 How Dan actually got his start in radio in Los Angeles

4:55 Early days at KFI: producer, board-op, traffic, and the Dr. Laura connection

6:40 Building Dr. Laura’s syndication station by station, the “old-school” way

7:35 Moving from behind the scenes to PD and host in Colorado Springs, Fort Wayne, Denver, and beyond

9:11 Starting in 1987 and what fascinated Dan about “behind the glass” radio

7:55–9:30 Classic “old days of radio” stories: smoking in studios and nude ballet in the control room

9:44 Why Dan left music radio and embraced talk: “I was a terrible disc jockey”

9:53 Growing up on LA talk radio in the back seat of a smoke-filled car

10:40 Learning production, call screening, and board-op skills at powerhouse KFI

11:59 The rush of live talk, callers, and flying without a net

12:17 Working mornings, spontaneity, and regretting what you said on-air

14:15 Discovering open lines on “America at Night” and the terror of unscreened calls

15:37 Yelling on-air after 30 years of being the “non-yeller” host

15:55 Has Dan ever been fired? Downsizing vs. “real” firing debate

16:43 Radio careers, layoffs, and never being unemployed more than 3 weeks

17:06 Moving markets with a family and the toll it takes at home

18:39 How constant moves impacted Dan’s kids and what they gained from it

19:13 Paying dues and why young would-be hosts need patience

19:41 From radio to podcasting: Dan’s show “Mostly Peaceful with Dan and Chris and Matt”

20:01 Why Dan still believes in radio even while podcasting

20:18 Missing radio so much it hurts: Johnny’s story of stepping away

20:47 Dan on being 58, counting down to retirement, and whether he’d really quit

22:03 Waking up at midnight, prepping for a 5 a.m. show, and the grind behind “just talking”

23:54 Being dragged into video kicking and screaming, then learning to love it

24:55 Teaching himself Premiere Pro and using ChatGPT for vertical content

25:53 Not wanting to be “the old guy who can’t change” and embracing video editing

26:32 Is video hurting radio? Serving stream viewers without abandoning listeners in cars

27:53 Theater of the mind vs. cameras in the studio

28:25 How streaming exposed radio’s wardrobe, and Dan’s wife fixing his on-camera look

29:41 Discovering audiences actually watch radio shows and their passion for live streams

30:44 Why listeners now complain when the video stream goes down

30:44–32:25 How many actual radios do they own now and reception issues even near big signals

33:06 First impressions of WTN, hearing Johnny and Phil and feeling intimidated

34:33 PD stories: “Who are you again?” and live-mic warnings in the hallway

35:30 Intimidation, team-building, and managing big talent without being an a-hole

36:26 Relief at stepping down as PD and focusing on mornings

37:54 Ten years as PD: ratings, revenue wins, and pride in WTN’s performance

38:22 Johnny calls Dan the best PD they had and why: he understood and loved talk radio

40:29 Navigating Phil Valentine’s death: grief, attacks on talk radio, and rebuilding afternoons

41:55 Processing grief late, after job changes and format shifts

44:40 Dan’s pride in the morning show era with Ken and Johnny: top-3 ratings run

45:51 Losing colleagues, changing lineups, and the necessity of adjusting in radio

47:01 How management trusted Johnny with a farewell show and why that never happens

47:44 Letting a beloved host say goodbye and why it worked

48:41 Love of working together, teasing, hugging, and Dan’s “stiff hugger” reputation

49:45 Dan’s wife Amy, support at home, and volunteering for too many fill-ins

51:04 Why Dan keeps saying yes: honor of being asked and knowing it won’t last forever

52:45 Conservative talk: from young liberal know-it-all to Reagan-style conservative

53:54 Rush, Glenn, Larry King, and the influences that sharpened Dan’s politics

55:54 Interviewing well: asking shorter questions and then getting out of the way

57:32 Worst interview: exhausted Kurt Cobain investigator who would not stop talking

59:00 The infamous Noel Monk (Van Halen) interview meltdown

1:01:00 Van Halen talk: Eddie vs. Dave, drugs, and missing entire eras in the history books

1:02:42 Wolfgang Van Halen and the new generation of that legacy

1:04:13 Rush reunion with Annika Niles on drums, and a drummer’s perspective on replacing Neil Peart

1:06:16 Different “feels” on drums and how two players can change the same song

1:07:22 Geddy Lee’s voice today, aging singers, and still going to see your heroes

1:09:00 Dr. Laura on SiriusXM, sounding exactly the same, and Dan’s memories of working w...

On this episode of Circling The Drain, Johnny B, Jay Harper and James Patrick McCarthy sit down with guitarist and broadcaster Dez Dickerson – best known as Prince’s original guitarist from the 1999 and Little Red Corvette era.

Dez takes us from his early days in Midwestern cover bands to his legendary audition with Prince, life on the road, opening for the Rolling Stones, his faith journey, leaving the band just as they were about to headline stadiums, and his unexpected path into conservative talk radio.

Along the way, the guys dive deep into Jimi Hendrix’s legacy, the darker side of the music business, the opioid epidemic and fentanyl, and why modern rock rarely hits as hard as it used to.

What you’ll hear in this episode:

- Dez’s wild origin story, starting professional gigs at 14 without even a driver’s license

- The real story behind his Prince audition and how “having the vibe” got him the gig

- Inside the infamous Rolling Stones opening shows and how Hells Angels changed the narrative

- Why he walked away from Prince’s band at the brink of stadium-headliner status

- Dez’s conversion to Christianity on the Dirty Mind tour and how it reshaped his choices

- Moving to Nashville, discovering the Christian music business and landing an A&R role

- How Phil Valentine pushed him toward talk radio – and why the mic felt like home

- His unapologetically conservative views, pushback he’s gotten, and “clear thinker” philosophy

- Guitar talk: Hendrix, Eddie Van Halen, Santana, bikers, death metal, and why no one is truly “original”

- Dez’s thoughts on today’s rock, podcasts vs radio, and what he wants to do next

Hit play for a fast, funny, honest conversation about music, faith, politics and life from someone who’s actually been there, on stage and on the air.

Listen, subscribe, and join the Drain Gang at: circlingthedrain.net

2:47 Dez’s first days with Prince and the audition at an empty tire shop

3:36 Growing up in Midwest cover bands and touring before he could drive

4:47 Inside the Prince audition: playing with the band vs trying to “blow them away”

6:38 Seeing Prince’s real personality after joining the band

8:04 Opening for the Rolling Stones, Hells Angels and getting “booed off stage” in the media

10:49 Dez’s conversion to Christianity on the Dirty Mind tour

11:17 Moral discomfort on stage and the moment he knew he had to leave

12:38 Intense years in the band and the image from the 1999 video

13:07 Little Red Corvette solo and Dez’s guitar legacy

13:19 Why and how Dez moved to Nashville and into A&R

15:11 Early days in Nashville and culture shock over a little snow

16:00 How Phil Valentine pushed Dez toward talk radio

18:01 Discovering talk radio feels like “home” and plans to blend radio and podcasting

19:41 The story behind the iconic kamikaze headband

21:27 Fan art, the faceless cartoon band, and Dez as a visual icon

22:03 Prince’s pain, opioids, fentanyl and the tragedy of his death

24:49 The opioid epidemic, fake fentanyl and near-misses with pain meds

26:17 Personal stories of back surgeries, painkillers and dependency

27:08 Dez’s first guitar, outgrowing lessons and early school gigs

29:25 Early career breaks, agents, and being “the kid who plays like Hendrix”

29:53 Guitar heroes: Clapton, Zeppelin, Grand Funk and growing into Hendrix influence

30:54 Winning over biker crowds and the Stones show irony

31:30 How Prince fused Sly Stone, Hendrix and the Stones’ Glimmer Twins

32:17 Hendrix’s unrealized future and his deep influence on guitar players

34:05 Being the only one at school mourning Hendrix and the “players’ player”

35:04 Eddie Van Halen, borrowing from Hendrix and other influences

37:04 Why “best guitarist” debates miss the point

37:31 Practice, grind and scaring your parents with your obsession

38:02 Reading music vs playing by ear and learning the Nashville number system

39:09 Reconnecting with Prince in Nashville and the “show after the show”

40:49 Sharing the stage with Larry Graham and surreal “Forrest Gump” moments

41:54 First Avenue stories, U2 and Minneapolis memories

42:26 Moving from cold Minnesota to too-hot Nashville

43:03 Dez’s conservatism, being “just to the right of Attila the Hun” and industry blowback

45:41 Leaving the Democratic Party and becoming a “clear thinker”

47:16 The problem with political echo chambers, even in conservative talk radio

48:12 Label me an American: political parties vs founding ideals

49:31 Why you cannot recreate Phil Valentine and why listeners still compare

50:09 Radio vs record labels and the business side of both worlds

51:00 Why copying Phil can never work and why he was a true radio rock star

52:32 Inside label culture in Nashville and signing left-of-center artists

53:47 How a meeting with Jimmy Bowen helped shape modern Christian music

55:01 How Prince’s band wrote and arranged: endless rehearsals and recorded jams

56:47 Creating The Time, Vanity 6 and how Morris Day got his band and career

58:32 Writing “He’s So Dull” and Prince “Prince-ing up” Dez’s ideas

59:17 Classic MTV videos, shooting 1999 and Little Red Corvette

1:00:19 Spot the reshot close-up in the 1999 video

1:01:23 Dez’s take on today’s rock and the bands that still move him

1:02:29 Guilty pleasures: death metal, screamo and Seven Dust

1:03:16 Darkness in lyrics, the state of the world and wanting more light

1:03:47 Wrapping up, future plans, Dez’s socials and the “Dez Dickerson Is Based” brand

1:05:05 Talk of Dez’s book, possible audiobook and closing thanks

Follow Johnny B:

https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co

In this episode of Circling The Drain, Johnny B, Jay Harper, and Jim McCarthy dive deep into the changing world of music and radio from the perspective of insiders who have lived it.

They start with why some artists get massive tribute concerts while others do not, then slide into a raw, honest look at country radio’s glory days, its corporate-driven decline, and what happens to artists and broadcasters when the industry moves on.

From Taylor Hawkins and Eddie Van Halen, to Waylon Jennings, Jason Aldean, Kacey Musgraves, and Tim McGraw, the guys unpack how careers peak and fade, how politics can tank a fan base, and why loyalty in production teams still matters.

Along the way, you will hear behind the scenes stories from Nashville radio, Country Radio Seminar, hall of fame inductions, and on air rivalries the hosts now regret. It is a brutally honest, funny, and nostalgic ride through a business that is, quite literally, circling the drain.

Listen for

– Why some legends get big tribute concerts and others never do

– How corporate ownership and streaming gutted local radio

– The unspoken 20 year shelf life of most country stars

– When politics and award shows push fans away

– Confessions about bashing other hosts on the air

– The Nashville radio names they still want to get on the podcast

Circling The Drain is a podcast about music, media, and entertainment before it all goes down the disposal.

2:12 – Taylor Hawkins vs Eddie Van Halen: who gets a tribute and why

3:55 – Waylon Jennings, tribute shows, and honoring musical “gifting”

6:10 – Radio as a launchpad: how on air skills still matter even when radio does not

7:05 – Inside Country Radio Seminar: from DJ convention to corporate schmooze fest

8:49 – Garth Brooks and Alan Jackson as “new artists” at CRS

10:28 – Early misreads: not being blown away by The Judds at first listen

12:17 – When record labels ruled: RCA, MCA, and the power to make stars

13:27 – The Nashville machine wakes up to radio’s decline and bankrupt clusters

14:22 – Getting tossed aside with age: musicians, flatbed truck gigs, and reality checks

15:32 – Why only a handful of artists have true decades-long careers

18:11 – Earl Thomas Conley: hit records, introversion, and painful live shows

19:58 – Country bars, boring sets, and what audiences really want

21:56 – Tim McGraw, Kenny Chesney, and the 20 year A list career arc

23:37 – What happened to Kacey Musgraves and the Dixie Chicks effect

24:55 – The cost of politics onstage and why some artists never learn

25:32 – Oscars, live streams, and why award shows feel pompous and out of touch

26:36 – CMT Awards, live vocals, and brutal pitch correction moments

27:47 – Waylon’s hearing loss and the studio tricks to keep him on pitch

28:42 – Jason Aldean’s “Try That In A Small Town” and the Columbia courthouse backlash

30:06 – Racism in the North vs South: a blunt Ohio story

30:58 – Jason Aldean’s production team loyalty and “do not fix what is not broken”

31:39 – Talk radio etiquette: why bashing other hosts is bush league

32:39 – Johnny’s regret over slamming Rick and Bubba on the air

35:00 – Howard Stern, rivalries, and when feuds actually helped the ratings

36:01 – Air Awards story: the Kanye West Bill Cody gag

37:28 – How industry awards slowly got cheaper and smaller

38:24 – Tennessee Radio Broadcasters Hall of Fame and forgetting key co hosts

40:00 – Phil Valentine, Terry Hopkins, and the show that made a career

42:29 – Brian Sargent, music director battles, and taking heat for the host

43:36 – A rare good GM: Dennis Ways and healthy radio culture

44:21 – Michael Dickey and the reality of ownership families

45:59 – Who they still want on: Nashville radio legends, especially women

47:07 – TV and weather crossovers: why they want Davis Nolan’s story

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https://www.facebook.com/john.e.bozeman

Follow Jay Harper:

https://www.facebook.com/harperjeff

Follow Jim:

http://www.jmvos.com

Circling The Drain is produced by It's Your Show dot Co

http://www.itsyourshow.co