The Installation Art Podcast

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A short catch-up episode after a break from podcasting over the European summer. I talk about chasing the balance between making this show, making my own work, and having a life.

We will hear from you for a change, I share feedback from supporters, from the listener poll and play some listener voice messages.

I also report back from the podcast-adjacent things I did manage while away: accidentally gatecrashing a private party at the TAKKK Art Center in Estonia to see Samuelle Green’s installation (the bird’s nest is still in it), skipping the Venice Biennale this year, and a run of Helsinki visits including Edith Karlson at Kiasma, Helsinki Contemporary, Amos Rex and HAM.

Season four opening guest also announced!

00:00 Back From Summer Break

01:15 Supporters and Requests

03:05 Listener Poll Feedback

04:20 Your Voice Messages

08:17 TAKKK Art Center visit in Estonia

11:47 Helsinki Art Highlights

15:18 Season Four Teaser

Also mentioned in this episode:

Chiharu Shiota: https://www.chiharu-shiota.com/

Elizabeth Day in episode 20: https://installationartpodcast.com/elizabeth-day-020

Mike Hewson in episode 41: https://installationartpodcast.com/mike-hewson-041

Sydney Contemporary: https://sydneycontemporary.com.au/

Goldsmiths University: https://www.gold.ac.uk/

Terry Gross, host of Fresh Air: https://www.npr.org/programs/fresh-air/

Guy Raz, host of How I Built This: https://www.npr.org/series/490248027/how-i-built-this

TAKKK Art Center: https://takkkdisain.wordpress.com/

Samuelle Green in episode 46: https://installationartpodcast.com/samuelle-green-046

Venice Biennale: https://www.labiennale.org/en

Bonus episode about Venice Biennale drama: https://installationartpodcast.com/bonus-031

Edith Karlson in episode 17: https://installationartpodcast.com/edith-karlson-017

Kiasma: https://kiasma.fi/en/

Helsinki Contemporary: https://helsinkicontemporary.com/

Michael Johansson in episode 47: https://installationartpodcast.com/michael-johansson-047

Amos Rex: https://amosrex.fi/

Helsinki Art Museum (HAM): https://www.hamhelsinki.fi/

Bonus episode on art in Helsinki: https://installationartpodcast.com/bonus-039

Richard Wilson: https://www.richardwilsonsculptor.com/

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: https://installationartpodcast.com/

Your host Anastasia Parmson: https://www.anastasiaparmson.art https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

Leave a voice message: https://www.speakpipe.com/installationartpodcast

Michael Johansson is a Swedish installation artist based in Malmö, known for precisely assembled sculptures and installations made from ready-made objects that he describes as ‘real life Tetris’. His work has been shown across Europe, Asia and beyond, and ranges from ephemeral site-specific installations to large-scale permanent public commissions cast in bronze.

What we cover:

• The art school realisation: being technically skilled at drawing is not the same as knowing what kind of art you want to make

• Sourcing from flea markets and secondhand stores

• Institutional installations made entirely from objects borrowed from a museum's own back rooms and storage

• Residencies for installation artists and the newer model he thinks would work much better

• The Taiwan passport disaster: two days to install a large site-specific work and why it turned out almost too good to be true

• Time as the greatest challenge: procrastinating until the last possible moment and forgetting to eat

• Moving a whole city: why an entire Swedish town is being relocated and how his new project is linked

09:00 Growing Up and Early Making

10:42 Finding Artistic Direction

13:15 Into Installations and Public Art

15:37 First Breakthrough Opportunities

18:08 Ready-Made Process Rules

20:42 Sourcing and Colour Logic

36:32 Fabricators and Collaborations

40:00 Residencies Reality Check

43:59 Taipei Install Panic

46:52 Afterlife of Installations

53:37 Work Life Balance Reset

01:00:02 Hard Truths and Highlights

01:07:16 Advice and Dream Projects

Michael Johansson is based in Malmö, Sweden. You can find out more about his work on his website: https://www.michaeljohansson.com/ and follow him on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/michaeljohansson/

Michael works with several international galleries:

Aeroplastics in Belgium: https://www.aeroplastics.net/ | https://www.instagram.com/aeroplastics_gallery/

Helsinki Contemporary in Finland: https://helsinkicontemporary.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/helsinkicontemporary/

GSA Gallery in Sweden: https://gsa.se/ | https://www.instagram.com/gsagallerystockholm/ | @gsagallery1690

Galleri Arnstedt Östra Karup in Sweden: https://www.galleriarnstedt.se/ | https://www.instagram.com/galleriarnstedt/

Galerie Ramakers in the Netherlands: https://www.galerieramakers.nl/ | https://www.instagram.com/galerieramakers2

Galeria Enrique Guerrero in Mexico: https://www.galeriaenriqueguerrero.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/galeriaenriqueguerrero/

Massimo Carasi – The Flat: https://www.carasi.it/ | https://www.instagram.com/theflat_massimocarasi

Galerie Hartwich in Germany: https://www.galerie-hartwich.de/ | https://www.instagram.com/galeriehartwich

44309//Gallery in Germany: https://44309gallery.net/ | https://www.instagram.com/44309gallery/

Galleri Christoffer Egelund in Denmark: https://christofferegelund.dk/ | https://www.instagram.com/gallerichristofferegelund/

Also mentioned in this episode:

Club Mate: https://www.club-mate.de/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/clubmate_original/

Lego: https://www.lego.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/lego | @LEGO

Airfix: https://uk.airfix.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/officialairfix/ | @OfficialAirfix

Preview Berlin: https://www.previewberlin.de/

Skog Art Space: https://skogart.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/skogartspace/

Helsinki Contemporary: https://www.helsinkicontemporary.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/helsinkicontemporary/

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large-scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: https://installationartpodcast.com/

Your host Anastasia Parmson: https://www.anastasiaparmson.art https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

Samuelle Green grew up in rural Pennsylvania in a family of makers and studied art at Tyler School of Art in Philadelphia and Parsons in New York. After nearly 20 years in NYC working across galleries, museums, fabrication and film sets, she made a pivotal decision: leave the city to have the space to finally build the work she had always wanted to make.

That work is large scale immersive installations built from rolled cones of reclaimed books and found paper. Exhibited across the US as well as in China, Italy, France and Estonia. Green’s work has also appeared on HBO and AMC+ and won the Arte Laguna Prize in Venice.

What we cover:

• The decision to leave New York City after nearly 20 years to reclaim her studio practice

• What it takes to create immersive installations out of paper and what happens when huge panels of work go missing two weeks before a show

• The accidental acoustic discovery: paper installations as anechoic chambers, concert venues and restaurant sound dampeners

• Creating art for TV and film sets and what artists should know before saying yes

• Reflective outdoor sculptures activated only by car headlights and flash photography and pivoting your medium after finding success

Samuelle Green is based in rural Pennsylvania and represented by Ivy Brown Gallery in New York and Bonham Gallery in Arrowtown, New Zealand. Her work is also available through Holly Hunt Design showrooms across the US.

You can see her reflective installation in person near Cochecton Fire Station at 54 County Road 114 in Cochecton, New York.

Find out more about her work on her website: https://samuellegreen.com and follow her on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/samuellegreen

03:44 Growing Up Creative

05:58 Leaving New York

08:10 First Big Break

09:49 Crowdfunding the Installation

15:33 Paper Durability and Storage

16:54 Install Timeline and Logistics

20:42 Safety and Public Interaction

22:51 Overseas Exhibitions

31:21 Grant Funded Pivot To Public Art

34:34 TV Film Set Work

42:53 Studio Practice And Sketches

55:45 Sound And Silence

Also mentioned in this episode:

Tyler School of Art: https://tyler.temple.edu/ | https://www.instagram.com/tyler_artandarchitecture/

Pearl Paint: https://www.pearlpaintco.com/

Parsons School of Design: https://www.newschool.edu/parsons/ | https://www.instagram.com/TheNewSchool/ | @thenewschool

Hatch Fund: https://thehatchfund.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/hatchfund/

Rosco flame retardant: https://au.rosco.com/en/products/roscoflamex | https://www.instagram.com/rosco_labs/ | @rosco_labs

TAKKK Symposium: https://www.takkksymposions.ee/en/sümpoosion | https://www.instagram.com/takkkkunstikeskus/

Holly Hunt Design: https://www.hollyhunt.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/hollyhuntdesign/ | @hollyhuntdesign

Art on Paper New York: https://ny.thepaperfair.com/

Morris Museum: https://morrismuseum.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/morrismuseum/ | @morrismuseum131

Taizé: https://www.taize.fr/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/taize | @taize

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: https://installationartpodcast.com/

Your host Anastasia Parmson: https://www.anastasiaparmson.art https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

I made a 3-minute listener survey to help shape the podcast's future. Your feedback genuinely matters.

Fill out here: https://forms.gle/qqHJrMXpsC9UYu2m7

Leave a voice message: https://www.speakpipe.com/installationartpodcast

Katriina Campitelli is a Toronto-based public art curator with Finnish and Italian roots who has spent over five years commissioning permanent and temporary public art across Canada. She started during the pandemic by creating a projection mapping festival when galleries shut down, and hasn't stopped since. This is a conversation from the other side of the public art table: what do public art curators actually do, what they are looking for and what many artists get wrong.

Katriina's work spans permanent commissions to ephemeral festivals, sculpture gardens and community engagement programs.

This episode is essential listening for any artist thinking about making the jump into public art. But it's equally fascinating for anyone who's ever walked past a sculpture and wondered how it got there.

What we cover:

• The percent-for-art funding model and why most permanent public art is tied to infrastructure budgets

• What a public art curator actually does start to finish

• Why the only way to learn public art is to make public art and why that's a genuine problem given that public art cannot fail

• The Drunk Frat Boy test: what your work needs before it can be installed in a public space

• The giant chrome cow that led to two years of community backlash

• Why Maurizio Cattelan's middle finger outside the Milan stock exchange became a permanent installation

• What selection panelists notice (and remember) about artists and why being kind is a strategic career choice

• Why public art matters beyond aesthetics: as a tool for economic development, wayfinding, community belonging and joy

05:40 Growing Up Between Cultures

07:20 Master's in Italy

10:23 What a Public Art Curator Does

17:19 Finding Artists

19:16 How to Start in Public Art

30:00 Community Buy-In and Cautionary Tales

37:14 Temporary vs Permanent Public Art

38:24 Design Longevity Rules

47:30 Community Engagement Wins

57:36 Advice for Applicants

01:03:46 Career Highlights

Katriina Campitelli is based in Toronto, Canada.

Find out more about Katriina’s work on her website https://katcampitelli.ca/ and follow her on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/katcampitelli/

Also mentioned in this episode:

JR: https://www.jr-art.net/ | https://www.instagram.com/jr/

Percent For Public Art: https://www.toronto.ca/city-government/planning-development/official-plan-guidelines/design-guidelines/percent-for-public-art-inventory/

Ron Baird: https://ronbairdartist.com/

National Film Board of Canada: https://www.nfb.ca/ | https://www.instagram.com/onf_nfb/ | @nfb

Maurizio Cattelan: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maurizio_Cattelan | https://www.instagram.com/mauriziocattelan/

Francesco Perilli: https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francesco_Perilli_(artista)

Joel Sears: https://joelsears.com/about-joel/

Alex Seton episode: https://installationartpodcast.com/alex-seton-024

The High Line: https://www.thehighline.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/highlinenyc

Fourth Plinth: https://www.london.gov.uk/programmes-strategies/arts-and-culture/current-culture-projects/fourth-plinth-trafalgar-square

Anish Kapoor: https://anishkapoor.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/dirty_corner

Claes Oldenburg: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claes_Oldenburg

Myfanwy MacLeod: https://www.myfanwymacleod.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/mittens_macleod_again/

Pasi Rauhala: https://pasirauhala.fi/ | https://www.instagram.com/pasirauhala/

Korkeasaari Zoo: https://korkeasaari.fi/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/korkeasaari/ | @Korkeasaareneläintarha

Amos Rex Museum: https://amosrex.fi/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/amoskonst/

Toronto Sculpture Garden: https://www.toronto.ca/explore-enjoy/history-art-culture/public-art/public-art-monuments-collection/comp-sculpture-garden/

National Gallery of Canada: https://www.gallery.ca/ | https://www.instagram.com/NatGalleryCan/ | @ngcmedia

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: https://installationartpodcast.com/

Your host Anastasia Parmson: https://www.anastasiaparmson.art https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

I made a 3-minute listener survey to help shape the podcast's future. Your feedback genuinely matters.

Fill out here: https://forms.gle/qqHJrMXpsC9UYu2m7

Leave a voice message: https://www.speakpipe.com/installationartpodcast

Aaron T Stephan is a sculptor and public artist who is so interested in process and materials, he builds and installs nearly every project himself. His permanent installations can be found all over the USA and he has also created numberous gallery installations and performative events. His work has been acquired by institutions like Portland Museum of Art, John Michael Kohler Arts Center and Farnsworth Art Museum.

This conversation is candid, funny and full of hard-won insight. Aaron grew up on a self-sustaining hippie farm in rural Maine where self reliance, making and fixing things was expected. That relationship with objects, materials and technique has never left him and sits at the core of everything he makes.

What we cover:

• Proposing projects you have no idea how to execute and teaching yourself new fabrication techniques on the fly

• Performative works where he builds structures around audiences mid-dinner or installs work as a live performance on-site

• Navigating job sites where artists have essentially no power and the only leverage you have is that they want you to leave

• What it actually takes to work at public scale and establishing a practice that lets you fail before you're locked in

• Why the projects that nearly break you are always the best ones

• Advice to artists who are intrigued by public art

Aaron T Stephan lives and works in Portland, Maine. You can see his permanent installations across the US, for example Woven Lines at City of Altoona, IA, Paths Rising at Tampa International Airport, Point of View at Salt Palace Convention Center, Salt Lake City and more.

More information on his website: https://aarontstephan.com and his Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aarontstephan/

Watch Aaron’s TED talk performance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=697QUP6iYw8

05:23 Childhood And Making

08:14 Art School And Wandering

09:46 How He Got Into Big Installations

11:12 Guardrail Knot Story

13:35 Torture And Magic

18:01 Building It Yourself

19:45 Funding Realities

24:48 Building Site Chaos

29:30 Hiring An Actor To Play Him At Openings

33:57 Public Art Hard Truths

38:59 Concrete Block Vortex Idea

47:13 Advice To Artists

Also mentioned in this episode:

Tampa International Airport: https://www.tampaairport.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/flyTPA | @FlyTPA

San Diego International Airport: https://www.san.org | https://www.instagram.com/sandiegoairport/

Texas Tech University: https://www.ttu.edu | https://www.instagram.com/texastech/

La Croix: https://www.lacroixwater.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/lacroixwater/

The Art Angle: https://news.artnet.com/multimedia/the-art-angle | https://www.instagram.com/artnet | @artnet

Purchase College: https://www.purchase.edu/ | https://www.instagram.com/purchasecollege/ | @PurchaseCollege

SUNY New Paltz: https://www.newpaltz.edu/ | https://www.instagram.com/sunynewpaltz | @sunynewpaltz

TEDxDirigo: https://www.tedxdirigo.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/tedxdirigo/

https://www.ted.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/ted | @TED

Maurizio Cattelan: https://www.perrotin.com/en/artists/maurizio-cattelan | https://www.instagram.com/mauriziocattelan/

Sears, Roebuck & Co: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sears

Matthew Mazzotta: https://www.matthewmazzotta.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/matthewmazzotta/

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: https://installationartpodcast.com/

Your host Anastasia Parmson: https://www.anastasiaparmson.art https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

I made a 3-minute listener survey to help shape the podcast's future. Your feedback genuinely matters.

Fill out here: https://forms.gle/qqHJrMXpsC9UYu2m7

Leave a voice message: https://www.speakpipe.com/installationartpodcast

Buy me a coffee: https://buymeacoffee.com/installationartpodcast

Donna Dennis is one of the contemporary art pioneers who pushed sculpture toward the domain of architecture in the early 1970s. Her complex sculptural installations draw from overlooked fragments of American vernacular architecture.

This conversation dives into five decades of art-making in New York's evolving art world. We discuss how she taught herself carpentry, pipe bending and electrical work to build pieces based on her body's scale. How Virginia Woolf's "Shakespeare's sister" gave her the drive to make work even if no one ever saw it. How feminism shaped her False Front Hotels as self-portraits when she decided "women's lives were worthy of study." And why she refuses to use the word "practice" to describe her work.

Donna's work is held in collections including Brooklyn Museum, the Walker Art Center, and the Smithsonian American Art Museum.

Key moments from this episode:

• From failing at abstract painting in Paris to her first steps toward installation

• SoHo in the 1970s: how big raw loft spaces made it possible for artists to think big

The Holly Solomon Gallery story: from studio visit ("we're buying a country house") to "I'm starting a gallery and I want you to be in it"—then Whitney Biennial within two years

Venice Biennale 1982: realizing in April the show is in June, not 1984—quit your job, six assistants, work doubling in size

• A car roll into the river in slow motion, with Donna’s belongings inside – and how that inspired a public artwork that also suffered a tragic end

• ”A woman made this!?" The comment that captures why size mattered

Donna Dennis is based in Germantown, New York. You can learn more about her work and subscribe to her newsletter on her website: https://www.donnadennisart.com

And follow her on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/donnadennisstudio

03:00 Hudson Valley Roots

04:07 Rapid Fire Warmup

05:06 Virginia Woolf Feminist Purpose

07:28 Night Studio Rituals

09:40 Early Art Calling

12:36 From Painting to Installations

47:28 Storage Risks

49:58 Hidden Vistas

51:19 Meaning And Mystery

54:34 Audience Boundaries

57:09 Vandalism Tale

01:04:01 Funding Choices and Final Reflections

Books mentioned:

Writing Toward Dawn: Journals 1969-1982: https://www.donnadennisart.com/publications/writing-toward-dawn

Donna Dennis: A Poet in Three Dimensions: https://www.donnadennisart.com/publications/donna-dennis-poet-in-three-dimensions

Also mentioned in this episode:

Petah Coyne: https://www.petahcoyne.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/petahcoyne/

Episode with Petah Coyne: https://installationartpodcast.com/petah-coyne-032

Robert Fulton: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Fulton

Virginia Woolf: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Room_of_One's_Own

Gustave Doré: https://www.wikiart.org/en/gustave-dore

Ben Shahn “The Shape of Content”: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/284780.The_Shape_of_Content

Art Students League: https://www.artstudentsleague.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/aslnyc/ | @ArtStudentsLeagueNY

Martha Diamond: https://marthadiamondtrust.org/ |

Carleton College: https://www.carleton.edu/ | https://www.instagram.com/carletoncollege | @CarletonCollege

Claes Oldenburg: https://www.wikiart.org/en/claes-oldenburg

Jane Bowles “Two Serious Ladies”: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/215262.Two_Serious_Ladies

Deafman Glance by Robert Wilson: https://robertwilson.com/deafman-glance

History of Art by Horst Waldemar Janson: https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/2693801-history-of-art

Peter Schjeldahl: https://www.newyorker.com/contributors/peter-schjeldahl

The New Yorker: https://www.newyorker.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/newyorkermag/ | @newyorker

The Poetry Project: https://www.poetryproject.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/poetry_project | @ThePoetryProject

Holly Solomon: https://bonhams.shorthandstories.com/the-collection-of-holly-solomon/

Andy Warhol: https://www.wikiart.org/en/andy-warhol

Denise Green: https://www.denisegreen.net/ |

Judy Pfaff: https://www.judypfaffstudio.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/judy.pfaff/

Whitney Biennial: https://whitney.org/exhibitions/the-biennial | https://www.instagram.com/whitneymuseum/ | @whitney_museum

Venice Biennale: https://www.labiennale.org/en | https://www.instagram.com/labiennale/ | @BiennaleChannel

O’Flaherty’s: https://www.donnadennisart.com/exhibitions/houses-and-hotels | https://www.instagram.com/oflahertys.nyc/

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: www.installationartpodcast.com

Your host Anastasia Parmson: www.anastasiaparmson.art https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

I made a 3-minute listener survey to help shape the podcast's future. Your feedback genuinely matters.

Fill out here: https://forms.gle/qqHJrMXpsC9UYu2m7

Leave a voice message: https://www.speakpipe.com/installationartpodcast

A candid review of the 25th Biennale of Sydney, spanning five venues across Greater Sydney: from a regional gallery that got everything right to an old Power Station full of missed opportunities.

I spent 10 hours at the media preview visiting all five venues: Lewers Penrith Regional Gallery, Chau Chak Wing Museum, Campbelltown Arts Centre, Art Gallery of New South Wales and White Bay Power Station. This isn't a comprehensive report, it’s my personal takeaway on what works (and what fails) when it comes to installation art at an international exhibition.

The 25th Biennale of Sydney, titled Rememory and curated by Hoor Al-Qasimi, demonstrates something that's come up again and again on this podcast: you can have prestigious artists, important topics and historic venues, but if the lighting is wrong, if there's nowhere to sit, if the space outshines the art… it doesn't work.

What I cover:

• Why Lewers: Penrith Regional Gallery was the standout venue

• Some highlighted works from each venue

• The 11-minute sound installation no one experiences beyond 15 seconds – and other accessibility challenges

• Documentation vs art – where is the line?

• A moment of comparison: do island Biennales create better experiences?

00:32 Biennale of Sydney Facts

02:57 Penrith Gallery Highlight

05:32 Everyone’s Favorite Installation

08:06 Chau Chak Wing Museum

10:31 Campbelltown Art Centre - Documentary Debate

13:21 Art Gallery of NSW Picks

17:12 White Bay Venue Challenges

22:26 Video Overload Critique

26:32 Installation Missteps

32:48 Final Takeaways

Biennale of Sydney 2026: Rememory is on view until 14 June 2026, free entry

More info: https://www.biennaleofsydney.art/

Review by art critic Christopher Allen: https://www.theaustralian.com.au/culture/worse-than-anticipated-how-the-sydney-biennale-became-a-site-of-mediocrity-and-irrelevance/news-story/efd37fe54c91806748fd89fda76f65f6

Also mentioned in this episode:

Biennale of Sydney: https://www.biennaleofsydney.art/ | https://www.instagram.com/biennalesydney/ | @biennaleofsydney

Venice Biennale episode: https://installationartpodcast.com/bonus-013

Helsinki Biennial episode: https://installationartpodcast.com/bonus-039

Lewers: Pentrith Regional Art Gallery: https://www.penrithregionalgallery.com.au/ | https://www.instagram.com/penrithregionalgallery/

Nora Adwan: https://noraadwan.com/home.html | https://www.instagram.com/adwan.nora/

Chau Chak Wing Museum: https://www.sydney.edu.au/museum/ | https://www.instagram.com/ccwm_sydney/

Michael Dagostino: https://www.sydney.edu.au/museum/about-us/our-people.html

Ema Shin: https://emashin.org/home.html | https://www.instagram.com/ema.shin/

Tuan Andrew Nguyen: https://www.tuanandrewnguyen.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/tuan.andrew.nguyen/

Cambelltown Arts Centre: https://www.campbelltownartscentre.com.au/Home | https://www.instagram.com/campbelltownartscentre/ | @campbelltownartscentre8258

Hoor Al-Qasimi: https://www.biennaleofsydney.art/hoor-al-qasimi/ | https://www.instagram.com/hooralq/

Joana Hadjithomas & Khalil Joreige: https://hadjithomasjoreige.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/studiohadjithomasjoreige/

Art Gallery of NSW: https://www.artgallery.nsw.gov.au/

Kuba Dorabialski: https://www.kubadorabialski.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/kubadora/

Mia Wasikowska: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1985859/ | https://www.instagram.com/mia_wasikowska_/

Taysir Batniji: https://www.taysirbatniji.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/taysir_batniji/

Kapwani Kiwanga: https://www.kapwanikiwanga.org/

Ron Mueck: https://ropac.net/artists/63-ron-mueck/ | https://www.instagram.com/ronmueckart/

Mike Hewson: https://mikehewson.co.nz/ | https://www.instagram.com/mikehewson/

MCA: https://www.mca.com.au/ | https://www.instagram.com/mca_australia | @mcaaustralia

White Bay Power Station: https://www.whitebaypowerstation.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/whitebaypowerstation/

Christopher Allen: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Allen_(critic)

Cockatoo Island: https://www.cockatooisland.gov.au/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/harbourtrust/ | @HarbourTrust2088

Frank Sweeney: https://franksweeney.art/ | https://www.instagram.com/frankbeee/

Hui Ye: https://yehui.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/huiyeist/

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: https://installationartpodcast.com/

Your host Anastasia Parmson: https://www.anastasiaparmson.art https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

Listener feedback form: https://forms.gle/T6ywdFawXWKLu1UR6

Leave a voice message: https://www.speakpipe.com/installationartpodcast

A conversation with New Zealand artist Mike Hewson, recorded inside his monumental installation The Key's Under the Mat at the Art Gallery of New South Wales – a 2,500 square meter underground park complete with working sauna, laundromat, barbecues, DJ booth, recording studio and playground that's broken every visitor record the gallery has ever seen.

Mike's practice straddles the complex lines between art, infrastructure and public liability. He designs playgrounds that councils don't know how to regulate, builds permanent public sculptures that must survive Australian weather conditions and human interference and he takes on legal exposure that would terrify most artists, all while fighting the perception that making functional, interactive work is somehow "beneath" serious art.

Key insights from this episode:

• The Christchurch earthquake moment: barefoot in a broken city, wondering whether he should keep pursuing art

• Project backlash: dealing with public anger, going into debt on his first major commission and lessons learned

• Strategic pivot: setting a new precedent as an artist-engineer

• True scope of the AGNSW project and how he sourced materials for it

• Hard truth and advice: burnout is not a sustainable business model

Mike Hewson is a New Zealand artist based in Sydney. You can find out more about his work on his website https://mikehewson.co.nz/ and follow him on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mikehewson

See his work in person:

The Key's Under the Mat at AGNSW Tank (open until August 2026) https://mikehewson.co.nz/2025/10/the-keys-under-the-mat

Coal Loader Palm Grove is a permanent public installation at Sydney Fish Markets: https://mikehewson.co.nz/2026/1/coal-loader-palm-grove

Rocks on Wheels public art playground in Soutbank, Naarm (Melbourne): https://mikehewson.co.nz/2022/11/rocks-on-wheels

Pockets Park in Pioneers Memorial Park, Leichhardt NSW: https://mikehewson.co.nz/2022/2/pockets-park

St Peters Fences at Simpson Park, St Peters NSW: https://mikehewson.co.nz/2020/9/st-peters-fences

Illawarra Placed Landscape at Crown Street Mall, Wollongong NSW: https://mikehewson.co.nz/2017/11/illawarra-placed-landscape

02:55 Work Life Balance Reality

05:35 Growing Up in Rural NZ

08:02 From Painting to Installations

19:40 Building Playgrounds as Art

27:37 Precarious Look Safe Design

32:32 Sourcing Found Materials

40:33 Maintenance and Record Crowds

45:41 Afterlife and Financial Reality

58:51 Geopets Art Fair Hack

01:07:17 Contracts, Insurance and Codes

01:20:51 Hard Truths And Advice

01:25:51 After The Mammoth Show

Also mentioned in this episode:

Christchurch earthquake: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Christchurch_earthquake

JR: https://www.jr-art.net/ | https://www.instagram.com/jr/

Columbia University: https://www.columbia.edu/ | https://www.instagram.com/columbia/ | @columbia

Sarah Sze: https://www.sarahsze.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/sarahszestudio

Lloyd’s: https://www.lloyds.com/australia | https://www.instagram.com/lloydsoflondon/ | @Lloydsinsurance

Infrastructure NSW: https://www.infrastructure.nsw.gov.au/ |

Gumtree: https://www.gumtree.com.au/ | https://www.instagram.com/gumtreeaus | @gumtreeaustralia

Lett Thomas Gallery: https://lett-thomas.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/michaellett | https://www.instagram.com/lettthomasgallery

Rirkrit Tiravanija: https://www.davidzwirner.com/artists/rirkrit-tiravanija | https://www.instagram.com/rirkrit_team

Sydney Fish Market: https://www.sydneyfishmarket.com.au/

Images courtesy of the artist and Art Gallery of NSW

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: www.installationartpodcast.com

Your host Anastasia Parmson: www.anastasiaparmson.art https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

I made a 3-minute listener survey to help shape the podcast's future. What's working? What's not? Who should I interview next? Your feedback genuinely matters. Fill out here: https://forms.gle/qqHJrMXpsC9UYu2m7

Get 15% off your .art domain name: https://get.art/?refdotart=art5044n9z17m

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A conversation with Dutch artist Tanja Smeets, whose site-specific installations employ diverse and industrial materials (concrete spacers, leaf catchers, textiles, ceramics and 3D-printed steel) to create large scale works that appear to grow organically from architecture and cityscapes.

Guided by her catchphrase “Under the pavement the roots are whirling,” Tanja's practice reveals what it takes to work at the intersection of art, craft, technology and collaboration.

Key insights from this episode:

• Why art school felt like failure

• Finding and transforming unusual materials

• Residencies at TextielLab and European Ceramic Work Center: pushing porcelain through frying sieves, learning embroidery and more

• The volcano eruption: teaching an assistant to knot lentils into lycra via Zoom when flights were grounded

• Miami airport interrogation: five suitcases, a letter and threatening border patrol agents with a lecture on art

Tanja Smeets is a Dutch artist based in Utrecht. Her work has been exhibited internationally including Manifesta and Museum Boijmans van Beuningen. See her work in person at

Westerpark, Amsterdam (permanent public sculpture) and Centraal Museum, Utrecht (permanent installation in historic staircase).

03:24 Favorite Quote – Under the Pavement the Roots Are Whirling

09:35 The Iceland Trip That Changed Everything

15:49 From Painting to Installation – When Everything Clicked

20:10 A Government Building Commission – Dripping Through Multiple Floors

22:50 How the Opportunities Started Coming

29:24 TextielLab – Combining Felt with Leaf Catchers

33:09 European Ceramic Work Center Residency

47:47 When the White Cube Doesn’t Work

48:52 Manifesta Barcelona – Installing on 5th-Century Graves

51:17 Building Solo vs Working with Teams

56:33 The Commercial Question – “I’m Always Disappearing into Big Installations”

01:02:10 Miami Airport – Five Suitcases and the Threat of a Lecture

01:06:56 MX3D Collaboration – 3D-Printed Stainless Steel

01:11:43 Finding Technical Collaborators and Pushing Boundaries

01:17:09 Dream Project

01:20:00 Advice for Emerging Artists

Opening of solo exhibition and launch of new publication and film about Tanja’s work: 11 April 2026 at the Utrecht in Leeuwarden.

The book can be ordered via studiotanjasmeets@gmail.com

You can find out more about her work at https://www.tanjasmeets.nl/ and follow her on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/studiotanjasmeets/

Also mentioned in this episode:

Dyckman Farmhouse Museum: https://dyckmanfarmhouse.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/dyckmanfarmhouse | @dyckmanfarmhousemuseum8502

Museum Boijmans van Beuningen: https://www.boijmans.nl/en | https://www.instagram.com/boijmans/

TextielMuseum: https://textielmuseum.nl/en | https://www.instagram.com/textielmuseum/

TextielLab: https://textiellab.nl/en

European Ceramic Work Centre: https://ekwc.nl/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/ekwc_oisterwijk/ @sundaymorningekwc6951

David Lynch: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Lynch

Eraserhead: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0074486/

Blue Velvet: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0090756/

Kunsthal KAdE: https://www.kunsthalkade.nl/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/kunsthal_kade_amersfoort | https://www.youtube.com/user/KUNSTHALKADE

Manifesta: https://manifesta.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/manifestabiennial/ | @Manifesta_foundation

Mondriaan Fund: https://www.mondriaanfonds.nl/en/homepage-2/ | https://www.instagram.com/mondriaanfonds/

Museum of Arts And Design: https://madmuseum.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/madmuseum | @madmuseum

Museum Vizcaya: https://vizcaya.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/vizcaya_museum/ | @VizcayaMuseum

Westerpark: https://www.iamsterdam.com/en/explore/neighbourhoods/westerpark | https://www.instagram.com/iamsterdam

MX3D: https://mx3d.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/mx3d.metal.printing/ | @officialMX3D

Centraal Museum Utrecht: https://www.centraalmuseum.nl/en | https://www.instagram.com/centraalmuseum

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: https://installationartpodcast.com/

Your host Anastasia Parmson: https://www.anastasiaparmson.art https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

Mentioned in this episode:

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A bonus solo episode about my last minute art trip to Helsinki: what I saw at Helsinki Biennale on Vallisaari island, three must-visit museums (Kiasma, Amos Rex, HAM), and why sometimes the best art experiences require a little effort to reach.

Last August, I hopped a ferry from Estonia to catch the closing days of Helsinki Biennale. In a day and a half, I discovered why island biennales create magic, why Nordic countries do art infrastructure better and what Australia can learn from Finland's approach to supporting artists and making contemporary art accessible to everyone.

This isn't a comprehensive review, it’s my honest impressions, favorite discoveries and a few rants.

What I cover in this episode:

• Why the ferry journey to Vallisaari island matters (hello, Cockatoo Island nostalgia)

• The challenge of installing art outdoors: scale, setting and competing with historic buildings

• Standout works: Sara Bjärland's bronze "inflatable" sculptures, Tania Candiani's immersive bunker installation, Ana Teresa Barboza's woven bark forest

• Three essential Helsinki museums: Kiasma (timeless favorite), Amos Rex (new obsession), HAM (Biennale HQ)

• Gushing about Helsinki Central Library (Oodi): free recording studios, 3D printing, instrument hire – everything Sydney libraries lack…

• Free museum days and artist benefits: how my Australian NAVA card got me free entry in Finland (but not in Sydney... explain that)

00:00 Why I Went To Helsinki Biennale

01:20 Getting to Vallisaari

03:31 Island Setting and Challenges

07:06 Scent Art Surprise

08:46 Standout Works

13:14 Lesson About Rushing

15:28 Rainy Day Museum Crawl: Kiasma

16:32 Amos Rex and HAM

21:44 Finland Artist Perks

23:37 Wrap Up and Listener Poll

Resources:

Listener survey - help shape this podcast! https://forms.gle/r2EN8w9C7wisUxJe7

Send a voice message: https://www.speakpipe.com/installationartpodcast

Write an email: https://installationartpodcast.com/contact

Also mentioned in this episode:

Helsinki Biennale: https://helsinkibiennaali.fi/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/helsinkibiennial/

Vallisaari: https://vallisaari.fi/en_US | https://www.instagram.com/vallisaari.fi

Biennale of Sydney: https://www.biennaleofsydney.art/ | https://www.instagram.com/biennalesydney/ | @biennaleofsydney

Cockatoo Island: https://www.cockatooisland.gov.au/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/harbourtrust/ | @HarbourTrust2088

Olafur Eliasson: https://olafureliasson.net/ | https://www.instagram.com/studioolafureliasson/

Raimo Saarinen: https://www.raimosaarinen.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/raimosaarinen/

Sara Bjarland: https://sarabjarland.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/sbjarland/

Tania Candiani: https://taniacandiani.com/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/tcandiani/

Ana Teresa Barboza: https://www.anateresabarboza.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/anateresa.barbozagubo/

Nabbteeri: https://www.nabbteeri.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/maria_birkhuhn/ | https://www.instagram.com/nabbage/

Kiasma: https://kiasma.fi/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/kiasmamuseum

Amos Rex: https://amosrex.fi/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/amoskonst/

Anna Estarriola: https://www.annaestarriola.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/annaestarriola/

HAM: https://www.hamhelsinki.fi/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/hamhelsinki/

Oodi: https://oodihelsinki.fi/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/oodihelsinki/

NAVA: https://visualarts.net.au/ | https://www.instagram.com/nava_visualarts/

Get up to 40% off your Hostinger plan: https://hostinger.com?REFERRALCODE=INSTALLATIONART

A philosophical conversation with Berlin-based artist Monika Grzymala, whose spatial drawings transform architecture with nothing but kilometers of black tape, intuition and intense physical labor.

Monika's practice is deceptively simple: she works alone, without assistants, using adhesive tape to create immersive three-dimensional drawings that respond to each unique space. But beneath that simplicity we discuss profound questions about ephemerality, energy, presence and what remains when a work only exists for weeks before disappearing…

From training as a stone sculptor to making her first site-specific drawing on ice at a Hamburg skating rink, from dumping all her figurative work after one transformative conversation with her professor to developing custom tape formulas with German manufacturers—Monika's journey reveals how radical simplicity can be the most powerful artistic choice.

Key insights from this episode:

• How one professor's comment changed everything

• The longevity of tape installations: 2-3 months before they fall apart (and why that's intentional)

• Documentation philosophy: why time-lapse videos don't capture the real process

• Living inside an installation: the collector who surrounded herself with Monika's work

• Advice for emerging artists: you don't need funding or large studios—just do it

Monika Grzymala is a Polish artist based in Berlin. You can find out more about her work on her website: http://www.t-r-a-n-s-i-t.net/ and follow her on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/monika.grzymala/

Monika’s publications: https://www.betterworldbooks.com/search/results?q=monika grzymala

She is represented by

Galerie CRONE: https://www.galeriecrone.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/galerie_crone/

BERG Contemporary: https://www.bergcontemporary.is/en | https://www.instagram.com/bergcontemporary/

SECCI Gallery: https://www.seccigallery.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/secci_gallery/

03:20 Studio Rituals

03:48 Berlin Life And Process

05:44 Origins And Training

08:01 Finding The Line

13:25 Ephemeral Tape Philosophy

31:24 Hunting For The Perfect Tape

32:21 Liquid Drawing Mindset

36:14 Funding Ephemeral Installations

38:06 Energy, Memory And Reality

41:31 Logistics And Documentation

56:15 Advice For Young Artists

Also mentioned in this episode:

MoMA: https://www.moma.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/themuseumofmodernart | @themuseumofmodernart

The Drawing Center: https://drawingcenter.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/drawingcenter/

Biennale of Sydney: https://www.biennaleofsydney.art/ | https://www.instagram.com/biennalesydney/ | @biennaleofsydney

Tokyo Art Museum: https://www.tobikan.jp/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/tokyometropolitanartmuseum/ | @tokyometropolitanartmuseum7280

Louise Bourgeois: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louise_Bourgeois | https://www.instagram.com/artistelouisebourgeois/

Documenta: https://documenta.de/en | https://www.instagram.com/documenta_official | @documenta_official

Bogomir Ecker: https://www.artforum.com/events/bogomir-ecker-2-226647/

Olafur Eliasson: https://olafureliasson.net/ | https://www.instagram.com/studioolafureliasson/ Dian Woodner: https://patronview.com/patrons/dian-woodner

Frac Lorraine: https://www.fraclorraine.org/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/fraclorraine/ | @49nord6est-fraclorraine

Kunstlerhaus Dortmund: https://www.kh-do.de/ | https://www.instagram.com/kuenstlerinnenhaus_dortmund | @kunstlerhausdortmund2577

Kunstmuseum Basel: https://kunstmuseumbasel.ch/ | https://www.instagram.com/kunstmuseumbasel/ | @kumubasel

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: https://installationartpodcast.com/

Your host Anastasia Parmson: https://www.anastasiaparmson.art https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

Get 15% off your .art domain name: https://get.art/?refdotart=art5044n9z17m

promo code: ART5044N9Z17M

Get Carrie's Artist Inventory Template here: https://www.seen.art/store/p/artist-inventory-template

A refreshingly candid conversation with Carrie Scott: curator, art consultant, broadcaster and founder of Seen, a media platform connecting the art world to the real world.

This is our most unfiltered episode yet, where we tackle topics that might "get us in trouble": what consultants actually charge, why artists should have elevator pitches (despite what famous curators say), whether museums should pay artists a percentage of ticket sales, and how galleries claim they'll "find you" while rejecting all submissions.

Carrie's career spans working with major galleries in Seattle and New York, collaborating with Nick Knight for a decade, launching groundbreaking exhibitions and now building a consultancy that refuses to be motivated purely by commission. She is opinionated, pragmatic and genuinely invested in making the art world less intimidating and more transparent.

Key insights from this episode:

• The real numbers: what art consultants charge

• Why Carrie is building an art consultancy that is not centered around transaction

• The controversial debate: should artists have an elevator pitch?

• What galleries mean when they say "don't contact us" (and should you ignore it)?

• Creative health as the third pillar of wellness alongside physical and mental health

• Practical advice for ambitious artists and where to find helpful resources

Carrie Scott is a curator, art historian, consultant and broadcaster based in London. She is the founder of Seen, a media platform and consultancy dedicated to connecting the art world to the real world.

You can find out more about her work at https://www.seen.art/ and follow her on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/carriescottcurates/

00:34 Carrie's Favorite Quote

03:34 Background and Early Life

07:13 Journey into Art and Education

09:58 First Job and Early Career Challenges

21:26 Transition to Consulting and Launching Her Own Business

40:24 The Value of Installation Art

43:48 Challenges in Monetizing Installation Art

45:35 Artist-Museum Revenue Sharing

52:05 Curating and Supporting Artists

56:26 Advice for Emerging Artists

01:09:45 Dream Projects and Future Plans

Also mentioned in this episode:

Brothers And Keepers by John Edgar Wideman: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/50891912-brothers-and-keepers

Overherd oat milk: https://overherd.uk/ | https://www.instagram.com/overherd.uk

The Wallace Collection: https://www.wallacecollection.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/wallacemuseum | @TheWallacecollection

Jean-Honoré Fragonard: https://www.wikiart.org/en/jean-honore-fragonard

Dickinson College: https://www.dickinson.edu/ | https://www.instagram.com/dickinsoncollege | @dsoncollege

Conde Nast: https://www.condenast.com/

University of Washington: https://www.washington.edu/ | https://www.instagram.com/uofwa/ | @universityofwashington

Seattle Magazine: https://seattlemag.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/seattlemag/

The Seattle Times: https://www.seattletimes.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/seattletimes/

Seattle University: https://www.seattleu.edu/ | https://www.instagram.com/seattleu/ | @seattleuniversity

The Stranger: https://www.thestranger.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/thestrangerseattle/

James Harris: https://jamesharrisgallery.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/jamesharrisgallery/

Rashid Johnson: https://www.hauserwirth.com/artists/2830-rashid-johnson/ | https://www.instagram.com/rashidjohnson/

Nicole Klagsburn: https://www.nicoleklagsbrun.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/nicole_klagsbrun_inc/

Matt Day Jackson: https://www.hauserwirth.com/viewing-room/matthew-day-jackson/ https://www.instagram.com/matthewdayjackson/

Mika Rottenberg: https://www.hauserwirth.com/artists/23390-mika-rottenberg/ | https://www.instagram.com/mikarottenberg/

Jimmy Moffat: https://www.instagram.com/jimmymoff/

Art + Commerce: https://artandcommerce.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/artandcommerce/

Annie Leibovitz: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annie_Leibovitz | https://www.instagram.com/annieleibovitz/

Steven Meisel: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Meisel | https://www.instagram.com/stevenmeiselofficial/

Nick Knight: https://www.nickknight.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/nick_knight/

180 Studios: https://www.180studios.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/180.studios/

The Art Show on Sky Arts: https://www.carrie-scott.com/theartshoq | https://www.instagram.com/artshowtv/ | @theartshow791

Simonette Quamina: https://www.simonettequamina.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/simonette_quamina/

John Pawson: https://www.johnpawson.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/johnpawson/

Arthur Jafa: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Jafa | https://www.instagram.com/anamibia/

Daelim Museum: https://www.daelimmuseum.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/daelimmuseum/ | @DaelimMuseum

The Design Museum: https://designmuseum.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/designmuseum | @designmuseum

Harland Millers: https://www.whitecube.com/artists/harland-miller | https://www.instagram.com/harlandmillers/

V&A: https://www.vam.ac.uk/ | https://www.instagram.com/vamuseum/ | @vamuseum

Tate: https://www.tate.org.uk/ | https://www.instagram.com/tate | @Tate

Ellen Jong: https://ellenjong.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/_____ellenjong/

SXSW: https://sxsw.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/sxsw/ | @SXSW

Lubaina Himid: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lubaina_Himid | https://www.instagram.com/lubainapics/

CIRCA: https://circa.art/ | https://www.instagram.com/circa.art/ | @CIRCA-ART

Max Neuhous: https://www.max-neuhaus.estate/

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: www.installationartpodcast.com

Your host Anastasia Parmson: www.anastasiaparmson.art | https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

Mentioned in this episode:

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An extraordinary conversation with Nicolas de Oliveira and Nicola Oxley, the writer-curator duo who literally wrote the books on installation art and founded the Museum of Installation in London. For nearly 40 years, they've been chroniclers, producers, curators, and advocates for a medium that barely had a name when they first started.

From publishing the definitive Installation Art books (1994, 2003) and commissioning hundreds of new works to building an extensive archive – Nicolas and Nicola have been at the coalface of installation art's evolution.

In this wide-ranging discussion, they share what it was like convincing galleries that installation art even existed, why good documentation became their mission, and how they've sustained independent curatorial practice for four decades on "absolute shoestring budgets."

Key insights from this episode:

• How installation art emerged and why galleries insisted it was "just sculpture"

• Coining the term "immersive" in their 2003 book (before it became ubiquitous)

• Their philosophy of curating as co-production

• The economics of independent spaces: how friendships sustain what funding cannot

• Why they turned down a massive London space and turned to making books

• The difference between installation art and the "entertainment industry" of immersive experiences

• Advice for emerging artists: practice comes first, outcomes come later

Nicolas de Oliveira and Nicola Oxley are based in London and run SE8 Gallery in Deptford. Their books Installation Art (1994) and Installation Art in the New Millennium (2003) remain foundational texts in the field.

They publish artist books under their imprint Mulberry Tree Press and continue to curate exhibitions internationally while maintaining one of the most extensive archives of installation art documentation in the world.

00:26 Discovering Installation Art

01:50 Early Influences and Inspirations

06:24 Founding Unit 7 Gallery

07:30 The Role of Documentation

14:45 Museum of Installation

18:30 SE8 Gallery and International Projects

20:05 Challenges of Space and Real Estate

24:10 Curatorial Practices and Artist Relationships

36:09 Writing Process and Collaboration

43:02 Funding and Sustainability

47:06 Installation Art and the Art Market

01:05:08 Supporting Artists Through Time and Commitment

01:07:36 Advice for Emerging Installation Practitioners

01:17:58 Curating Shows in Different Countries

01:24:09 Documenting and Archiving Installations

01:43:44 Defining Installation Art and Its Future

SE8 Gallery: https://se8.gallery/ | https://www.instagram.com/nicode.oliveira

Installation Art (1996): https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/12208566-installation-art

Installation Art in the New Millennium (2003): https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1972215.Installation_Art_in_the_New_Millennium

Our interview with Hans op de Beeck: https://installationartpodcast.com/hans-op-de-beeck-018

Bonus episode: What is Installation Art: https://installationartpodcast.com/bonus-025

Bonus episode: Why This 2026 Venice Biennale Scandal is Splitting the Art World: https://installationartpodcast.com/bonus-031

Also mentioned in this episode:

Goldsmith’s University: https://www.gold.ac.uk/ | https://www.instagram.com/goldsmithsuol/ | @GoldsmithsUoL

Arte Povera: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arte_Povera

Yves Klein: https://www.yvesklein.com/en/yves-klein/ |

Allan Kaprow: http://www.allankaprow.com/

Dan Graham: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Graham

Rachel Whiteread: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rachel_Whiteread | https://www.instagram.com/rachelwhitereadofficial/

Bruce Nauman: https://www.moma.org/artists/4243-bruce-nauman | https://www.instagram.com/brucenaumanart/

Edward Woodman: https://jhg.art/events/space-light-and-time-edward-woodman-a-retrospective/

Helen Chadwick: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helen_Chadwick

Thames & Hudson: https://www.thamesandhudson.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/thamesandhudson

ICA London: https://www.ica.art/ https://www.instagram.com/icalondon/

Whitechapel Gallery: https://www.whitechapelgallery.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/whitechapelgallery | @whitechapelgallery

Camden Art Centre: https://camdenartcentre.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/camdenartcentre/ | @camden-art-centre

Museum of Installation: https://www.moca.london/moi.html | https://www.tate.org.uk/whats-on/tate-britain/museum-of-installation-archive

New Museum: https://www.newmuseum.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/newmuseum/ | @newmuseum

Phyllida Barlow: https://www.hauserwirth.com/artists/2826-phyllida-barlow/

KW Institute for Contemporary Art: https://www.kw-berlin.de/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/kwinstitutefcontemporaryart/

Boris Groys: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boris_Groys

Goshka Macuga: https://www.moma.org/artists/131293-goshka-macuga | https://www.instagram.com/gonogo.space/?hl=en

Hans op de Beeck: https://hansopdebeeck.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/hans_op_de_beeck/

Dave Hickey: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dave_Hickey

Stefan Brüggemann: http://www.stefanbruggemann.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/stefanbruggemann1975/

Chris Kraus: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Kraus_(writer) | https://www.instagram.com/chriskraus7/

Jonathan Lethem: https://jonathanlethem.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/jonathanlethem/

Richard Wilson: https://www.richardwilsonsculptor.com/

Lucy R. Lippard: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucy_R._Lippard

Giulio Paolini: https://www.mariangoodman.com/artists/57-giulio-paolini/

Pistoletto: https://www.pistoletto.it/eng/home.htm

Eva Hesse: https://www.hauserwirth.com/artists/2810-eva-hesse/

Marcel Broodthaers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marcel_Broodthaers

Moon and Jeon: https://moonandjeon.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/moonandjeon/

Documenta: https://documenta.de/en | https://www.instagram.com/documenta_official | @documenta_official

Tate: https://www.tate.org.uk/ | https://www.instagram.com/tate | @Tate

Ian Kiaer: https://alisonjacques.com/artists/ian-kiaer

Olivia Guigue: http://www.oliviaguigue.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/oliviaguigue/

Pearl Jam: https://pearljam.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/pearljam

A Book of Burning Matches exhibition: https://repository.londonmet.ac.uk/6423/1/De-Oliveira_ A-Book-of-Burning-Matches_V3.pdf

David Price on Substack: https://davidpricework.substack.com/

Lucia Nogueira: https://www.luhringaugustine.com/artists/lucia-nogueira#tab:thumbnails

Patrick Jolley: http://www.patrickjolley.com/

Joseph Kosuth: https://www.skny.com/artists/joseph-kosuth | https://www.instagram.com/josephkosuthstudio/

Hal Foster: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hal_Foster_(art_critic)

Komar and Melamid: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Komar_and_Melamid

Hans Haacke: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Haacke

Sea of Tranquility: https://hansopdebeeck.com/bookshop/sea-of-tranquillity

Sand novella: https://www.abebooks.com/first-edition/Hans-Beeck-Sea-Tranquility-novella-Sand/30087411544/bd

Ole Jørgen Ness: https://galleririis.com/exhibitions/6

Marit Følstad: https://folstad.net/ | https://www.instagram.com/maritfoelstad/

Christo & Jeanne Claude: https://christojeanneclaude.net/ | https://www.instagram.com/christojeanneclaude

Ilya Kabakov: https://www.kabakov.net/

Hauser & Wirth: https://www.hauserwirth.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/hauserwirth/ | @HauserWirth

Leal Rios Foundation: https://lealriosfoundation.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/fundacaolealrios/

Me Collectors Room Berlin: https://www.instagram.com/mecollectorsroom/

Dialogue Gallery Lisbon: https://dialoguegallery.pt/ | https://www.instagram.com/dialogue.gallery/

Appleton Lisbon: https://appleton.pt/about/ | https://www.instagram.com/appletonassociacaocultural/

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: tiktok.com/@installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: www.installationartpodcast.com

Your host Anastasia Parmson: www.anastasiaparmson.art | https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

Try Descript: https://get.descript.com/s8kjemvu79fz

An in-depth conversation with award-winning sculptor and installation artist Zadok Ben-David, whose practice spans delicate miniature work to large-scale public installations. From his early beginnings in Yemen and Israel to representing his country at the Venice Biennale, Zadok shares the philosophical and practical journey behind his internationally acclaimed work. Discover how he transforms metal into poetic metaphors exploring human nature, evolution, and our relationship with the natural world (and how one installation changed a stranger's life forever).

Key insights from this episode:

• The path from abstract expressionism at St Martin's School of Art to creating massive figurative installations

• How 30,000 hand-painted flowers became one of the world's most travelled installations and the team of assistants who helped create them

• Behind the scenes of installing work across five continents, from prisoners in Germany to 70 assistants in Uzbekistan

• The commercial strategy that funds large-scale installations through smaller original works

• Why Zadok turned down a $1 million public art commission to maintain artistic integrity

• The profound moment when his Blackfield installation helped a Holocaust survivor find hope again

Zadok Ben-David is based in London and Portugal. You can find out more about his work on his website https://www.zadokbendavid.com/ and follow him on Instagram @zadokstudio https://www.instagram.com/zadokstudio/

Exhibition “FLOWERS. Art from the Renaissance to Artificial Intelligence” in Rome until 22 February 2026: https://www.chiostrodelbramante.it/post_mostra/flowers-flowers-art/

03:27 Work-Life Balance Insights

06:15 Journey to Art and Family Influence

09:17 Art School Challenges and Triumphs

10:19 Moving to London and Early Struggles

15:15 Discovering Sculpture and Teaching

21:06 First Installations

25:17 Animal Metaphors in Art

34:25 Global Exhibitions and Unique Experiences

38:23 Commercial Aspects of Art

40:33 People I Saw, But Never Met

44:58 Art Installations Around the World

48:58 The Other Side of Midnight

54:44 Challenges in Art Installations

01:04:37 The Healing Power of Art

01:11:40 Upcoming Exhibitions and Contact Information

Also mentioned in this episode:

Anish Kapoor: https://anishkapoor.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/dirty_corner/

Jerusalem Art Academy: https://www.bezalel.ac.il/en | https://www.instagram.com/bezalel_academy | @bezalelacademyofartanddesi1460

University of Reading: https://www.reading.ac.uk/ | https://www.instagram.com/uniofreading/ | @UniofReading

Chelsea College of Arts: https://www.arts.ac.uk/colleges/chelsea-college-of-arts | https://www.instagram.com/unioftheartslondon/ | @UniversityoftheArtsLondon

Central Saint Martins: https://www.arts.ac.uk/colleges/central-saint-martins | https://www.instagram.com/unioftheartslondon/ | @UniversityoftheArtsLondon

Anthony Caro: https://www.anthonycaro.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/anthonycarocentre/

Aesop: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aesop's_Fables

Krylov: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Krylov's_fables

Kröller-Müller Museum: https://krollermuller.nl/en | https://www.instagram.com/krollermullermuseum/

Kunsthal Rotterdam: https://www.kunsthal.nl/en/#tijdlijn-2026-03 | https://www.instagram.com/kunsthal/ | @KunsthalRotterdam

Art Gallery of Uzbekistan: https://uzbekistan1.com/art-gallery-of-uzbekistan/

Neanderthal Museum: https://neanderthal.de/en | https://www.instagram.com/neanderthalmuseum/ |@NeanderthalMuseum

Sculpture by the Sea: https://sculpturebythesea.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/sculpturebythesea | @sculpturebythesea

National Museum of the Republic of Kazakhstan: https://nmrk.kz/en/ | @qazaqstanrespyblkasynynult9862

Annandale Galleries: https://annandalegalleries.com.au/ | https://www.instagram.com/annandalegalleries/

Ploshchad Mira Museum Center: https://mira1.ru/about | @na_mira1

Krasnoyarsk Museum Biennale: https://biennale.ru/

Joseph Beuys: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Beuys

GYRE: https://gyre-omotesando.com/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/gyre_omotesando/ | @gyreTV

Chiostro del Bramante: https://www.chiostrodelbramante.it/post_mostra/flowers-flowers-art/ | https://www.instagram.com/chiostrodelbramante_roma | @chiostrodelbramante

Andreas Gursky: https://www.andreasgursky.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/andreasgursky_official

Ai Weiwei: https://www.aiweiwei.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/aiww/

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

Tiktok: @installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: www.installationartpodcast.com

Your host Anastasia Parmson: www.anastasiaparmson.art | https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

Mentioned in this episode:

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In this bonus episode, host Anastasia Parmson explores what it really means to approach residencies as an installation artist. Beyond the logistics of time, space, and materials, we dive into bigger questions that shape the medium:

• How to make large-scale, site-specific work in short timeframes and unfamiliar contexts?

• What happens when you choose temporary or fragile materials instead of archival ones?

• Is the value of installation art in the object, the process or the audience experience?

• Could installation art be considered disposable or should we always aim for permanence?

Drawing from a recent experimental residency at DRAW Space in Sydney, Anastasia reflects on the challenges of working fast, improvising with cardboard and collaborating with others. But more importantly, you’ll be invited to consider your own approach to residencies, materials, and the long-term value of installation art.

Whether you’re an installation artist or simply curious about how these questions play out in practice, this episode offers insights and provocations designed to spark discussion.

00:00 Introduction and Listener Review

01:54 Invitation to Draw Space Residency

03:47 Challenges and Initial Thoughts

06:10 Execution and Community Involvement

08:21 Building the Installation

12:01 Final Touches and Open Day

15:43 Reflections on the Experiment

24:49 Conclusion and Future Plans

Did this episode raise questions or spark ideas?

We’d love to hear from you! Share your thoughts, stories, or residency experiences:

• Leave a voice message: https://www.speakpipe.com/installationartpodcast

• Send a DM on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

• Use the contact form: https://installationartpodcast.com/contact

Buy me a coffee: https://buymeacoffee.com/installationartpodcast

Also mentioned in this epsisode:

DRAW Space: https://drawspace.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/drawspacesydney

Mentioned in this episode:

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An enlightening conversation with celebrated Danish artist Uffe Isolotto. Discover his journey from growing up in a remote town in Denmark to being selected to represent his country at the prestigious Venice Biennale.

Learn how Uffe balances work and life, the nuances of his collaborative process, and his unique approach to installation art.

Key insights include:

• The role of music and collaboration in his creative process.

• Uffe’s early inspirations and how he evolved from poetry to visual art.

• The logistics and challenges of creating large-scale immersive installations and collaborating with other artists and craftsmen.

• Behind-the-scenes about preparing for the Venice Biennale and the unexpected aftermath.

• Future projects and Uffe’s interest in film and world-building as part of his artistic practice.

Tune in to gain a deeper understanding of Isolotto’s process and his innovative approach to contemporary installation art.

You can follow Uffe on Instagram at @uffeisolotto https://www.instagram.com/uffeisolotto/ and learn more about his installation for the Danish Pavilion at Venice Biennale at @wewalkedtheearth https://www.instagram.com/wewalkedtheearth

04:47 Journey into Art and Education

10:07 First Major Projects and Public Art

12:34 Venice Biennale Experience

15:57 Collaborations and Challenges

18:19 Creative Process and World Building

28:04 Skills and People Management

30:49 Exploring Hyperrealistic Sculpture

31:30 Post-Venice Reflections

33:14 Venturing into Filmmaking

37:40 Artistic Practice and Longevity

44:49 Funding and Challenges

54:52 Advice for Young Artists

58:04 Current Projects and Future Plans

PS: We ran into a few technical issues during the recording of this episode, which means a small section of the conversation didn’t make it into the final cut and the audio isn’t perfect throughout. We appreciate your understanding.

Also mentioned in this episode:

NTS Radio: https://www.nts.live/ | https://www.instagram.com/nts_radio/ | @NTSLIVEUK

Danish Art Foundation: https://www.kunst.dk/english/about-us | https://www.instagram.com/statenskunstfond/

Thomas Foldberg: https://thomasfoldberg.dk/ | https://www.instagram.com/thomas_foldberg_studio/

Lars Von Trier: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001885/ | https://www.instagram.com/larsvontrier_/

Soft Baroque: https://softbaroque.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/soft_baroque/

Anne Sofie Madsen: https://www.instagram.com/annesofiemadsenstudio/

Carlsberg Foundation: https://www.carlsbergfondet.dk/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/carlsbergfondet/ | @Carlsbergfondet1876

Simon Starling: https://www.contemporaryartlibrary.org/artist/simon-starling-14184

Den Frie: https://denfrie.dk/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/denfrie.cph/

Holstebro Kunstmuseum: https://en.holstebrokunstmuseum.dk/ | https://www.instagram.com/holstebrokunstmuseum/

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast

Tiktok: @installationartpodcast

📚 More information about the show and previous episodes:

https://installationartpodcast.com/

Your host Anastasia Parmson: www.anastasiaparmson.art | https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

🗣️ Join the conversation in our Linkedin group The Installation Art Society, a space for conversations about installation art and a platform for practitioners to share insights, discuss technical aspects, and exchange behind-the-scenes stories:

https://www.linkedin.com/groups/14532340/

Episode 32 features an unforgettable conversation with acclaimed New York-based sculptor and installation artist Petah Coyne. Known for her intricate, large-scale works crafted from an extraordinary range of materials – from dead fish and shredded trailers to wax, taxidermy, and black sand. Coyne’s career spans decades and her works are in major museum collections, including MoMA, the Whitney, the Met, and the Guggenheim.

In this candid, in-depth interview, she shares not only her creative evolution and technical processes but also the personal stories, risks, and moments of doubt behind her monumental career.

Key takeaways from this interview include:

• The wild true story of how 5,000 dead fish played a role in launching her art career.

• How Petah developed her own patented wax formula and the extreme logistics behind shipping large-scale works across the world.

• A behind-the-scenes account of her first major institutional installation and the unexpected accident that helped get it reviewed by The New York Times.

• Her perspective on rejection, persistence, and why she applied for grants every year for a decade before getting one.

• Thoughtful reflections on time, mortality, and the pressure artists feel to keep creating.

From poetic anecdotes to hard-earned wisdom, this episode offers a rare glimpse into the mind of a successful and deeply generous artist whose work, like great literature, lingers long after the first encounter.

03:52 The Dead Fish Prank

07:36 Early Life and Artistic Beginnings

14:40 How To Avoid School

16:00 Moving to New York

22:22 First Big Break and Installation Art

41:34 The Importance of Archival Quality

46:22 Finding and Working with Assistants

48:53 Fragility and Tactility of Artworks

51:09 The Stolen Sculpture Incident

54:36 Selling Large Sculptures to Collectors

01:07:04 Navigating the Art World

01:09:52 The Importance of Feedback

01:24:56 Funding Art Projects

01:31:01 Experimenting with New Mediums

01:37:43 Final Thoughts and Advice To Artists

Petah Coyne is based in New York and is represented by Galerie Lelong & Co., New York: https://galerielelong.com/artists/11-petah-coyne/

and Nunu Fine Art, Taiwan: https://www.nunufineart.com/petah-coyne

You can find out more about her work on her website: https://www.petahcoyne.org/

And follow her on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/petahcoyne

Also mentioned in this episode:

The Jealous Curator: https://thejealouscurator.substack.com/about | https://www.instagram.com/thejealouscurator/

Art For Your Ear Podcast, interview with Petah Coyne: https://www.thejealouscurator.com/blog/2020/11/20/just-be-wonderful/

Herron School of Art and Design: https://herron.indianapolis.iu.edu/

Art Academy of Cincinnati: https://www.artacademy.edu/ | https://www.instagram.com/artacademyofcincinnati/ | @artacademycincinnati

Columbia University: https://www.columbia.edu/ | https://www.instagram.com/columbia/ | @columbia

Jody Pinto: https://www.jodypinto.com/

Alice Acock: https://www.aaycock.com/

Donna Dennis: https://www.donnadennisart.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/donnadennisstudio/

Judy Pfaff: https://www.judypfaffstudio.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/judy.pfaff/

Holly Solomon: https://www.bonhams.com/stories/39878/works-from-the-collection-of-holly-solomon/

Sculpture Center: https://www.sculpture-center.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/sculpturecenter/#

Marian Griffiths: https://www.artforum.com/news/marian-griffiths-1922-2008-189230/

Leo Castelli: https://www.castelligallery.com/about/leo-castelli | https://www.instagram.com/castelligallery

Adam Gopnick: https://www.adamgopnik.com/bio | https://x.com/adamgopnik

Chazen Museum of Art: https://chazen.wisc.edu/

Eva Hesse: https://www.theartstory.org/artist/hesse-eva/

Sol LeWitt: https://www.theartstory.org/artist/lewitt-sol/

Mary Sabbatino: https://www.cpal-info.com/mary-sabbatino | https://www.instagram.com/mary_sabbatino/

Gallery Lelong: https://galerielelong.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/galerielelong

Guerilla Girls: https://www.guerrillagirls.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/guerrillagirls/ | @GUERRILLAGIRLS

Iréne Hultman: https://tdps.yale.edu/profile/irene-hultman-monti | https://www.instagram.com/irenehultmanmonti/

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

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In this bonus episode of the Installation Art podcast, curator and art consultant Carrie Scott joins me to delve into the ongoing controversy surrounding the Venice Biennale Australian Pavilion.

Together we discuss:

• How artist Khaled Sabsabi and curator Michael Dagostino were appointed to represent Australia at the 2026 Venice Biennale and then abruptly cancelled

• The procedural, political, and social dimensions of the decision made by Creative Australia, its impact on the local and international art scene, and what it means for artistic freedom

• How the Australian arts community is responding to the shock decision

• Carrie shares her personal experiences and insights, offering a poignant perspective on the value of art that challenges and provokes.

We also touch on recent tragic news that affects the Biennale more broadly and raises questions about who has the authority to decide what kind of art is “acceptable” or what art is about.

05:02 The Australian Pavilion Controversy: An Overview

06:51 Selection Process for the Australian Pavilion

10:46 Creative Australia's Decision and Backlash

12:10 Senate Hearing and Further Repercussions

17:36 Personal Reflections on the Controversy

38:40 National Pavilions and Curator's Theme

39:09 Tragic Passing of Koyo Kouoh

42:38 Journalist's Role and Agenda

45:16 Art and Political Sensitivities

48:14 Personal Reflections on 9/11

53:16 Curatorial Challenges and Responses

58:59 Speculations and Broader Implications

Carrie Scott is a curator and art consultant based in London: https://www.carrie-scott.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/carriescottcurates/

SEEN is a next-generation art consultancy, shining a light on the opaque world of galleries, auction houses and dealers: https://www.seen.art/ | https://www.instagram.com/watchseenart/ | @watchseenart

📬 Got comments? Share your thoughts: SpeakPipe.com/InstallationArtPodcast

Or DM us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

If you want to help the Sabsabi-Dagostino project in Venice, go to this website: https://khaledsabsabi.com/support-the-venice-biennale-2026-exhibition-by-khaled-sabsabi-curated-by-michael-dagostino/

Or purchase a unique artwork by Sabsabi to help raise funds: https://unvanishedsabsabi.myshopify.com/

Khaled Sabsabi speaks: https://www.abc.net.au/listen/programs/the-art-show/khaled-sabsabi-speaks/105050484

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/audio/2025/apr/01/exclusive-khaled-sabsabi-speaks-on-the-damage-of-being-dumped-from-the-venice-biennale-full-story-podcast

Also mentioned in this episode:

Khaled Sabsabi: https://khaledsabsabi.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/peacefender/

Michael Dagostino: https://www.sydney.edu.au/museum/about-us/our-people.html

Creative Australia: https://creative.gov.au/ | https://www.instagram.com/creative.australia/

Venice Biennale: https://www.labiennale.org/en | https://www.instagram.com/labiennale/ | @BiennaleChannel

Adrian Collette: https://www.linkedin.com/in/adrian-collette-31a192ba/?originalSubdomain=au

The Australian article “Your Taxpayer Dollars At Work: Arts Council takes Creative Approach to Racism” https://www.theaustralian.com.au/subscribe/news/1/?sourceCode=TAWEB_WRE170_a_GGL&dest=https://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/margin-call/arts-council-takes-creative-approach-to-racism/news-story/00e630f4d43423d15892ead5cfadaf8d&memtype=anonymous&mode=premium&v21=HIGH-Segment-2-SCORE&V21spcbehaviour=appendend

Memo: https://www.memoreview.net/ | https://www.instagram.com/memo_review/

MCA Sydney: https://www.mca.com.au/ | https://www.instagram.com/mca_australia | @mcaaustralia

Liz-Ann McGregor op-ed: https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2025/feb/18/australia-venice-biennale-sabsabi-dumped-former-museum-contemporary-art-head-says-ntwnfb

Thank You Very Much, 2006: https://khaledsabsabi.com/work/thank-you-very-much/

Monash University Museum of Art: https://www.monash.edu/muma/home | https://www.instagram.com/mumamonash

Lindy Lee: https://www.lindylee.net/ | https://www.instagram.com/lindylee.13/

Simon Mordant: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Mordant

Koyo Kouoh: https://curatorsintl.org/about/collaborators/5322-koyo-kouoh | https://www.instagram.com/madamekoyo/

Interview with Koyo Kouoh: https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/the-art-world-what-if/id1203133627?i=1000649955901

Hank Willis Thomas: https://hankwillisthomas.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/hankwillisthomas/

Lubaina Himid: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lubaina_Himid | https://www.instagram.com/lubainapics/

Josh Milani: https://milanigallery.com.au/ | https://www.instagram.com/milanigallery

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

📢 Follow us on social media:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/installationartpodcast/

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📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: www.installationartpodcast.com

Your host Anastasia Parmson: www.anastasiaparmson.art | https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

🗣️ Join the conversation in our Linkedin group The Installation Art Society, a space for conversations about installation art and a platform for practitioners to share insights, discuss technical aspects, and exchange behind-the-scenes stories: https://www.linkedin.com/groups/14532340/

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In this episode, we speak with Elizabeth Lewis, Public Art Division Manager at Tilt Industrial Design, who offers a fascinating insider's perspective on how large-scale public artworks are engineered, managed, and brought to life. Elizabeth reveals the complex ecosystem of stakeholders involved in creating public art and shares invaluable advice for artists looking to break into this challenging but rewarding medium.

What you will learn:

• How industrial designers like Elizabeth act as "translators" between artists' creative visions and the technical requirements needed to bring monumental works to life

• The truth about public art budgets and practices

• Practical advice for artists wanting to venture into public art, including starting with temporary installations and test sites

• How indigenous artists are bringing multidisciplinary approaches to public art that may reshape the entire field

About Elizabeth Lewis:

Elizabeth Lewis is the Public Art Division Manager at Tilt Industrial Design, an Australian firm specialising in technically complex and ambitious public art projects. With a background in industrial design, she has overseen numerous large-scale installations throughout Australia, working with established artists, emerging creators, and First Nations storytellers to translate artistic visions into enduring public works.

03:17 Early Life and Inspirations

04:39 Educational Journey

05:39 First Job Experiences

08:01 Transition to Tilt

14:58 Challenges in Public Art

18:29 Skills and Learning

33:50 Project Timelines

35:55 The Lifespan of Public Art

45:49 The Role of Public Art Curators

48:01 Building Networks and Identifying Artists

50:49 First Nations and Indigenous Art

53:01 The Growth of Public Art in Sydney

59:09 Convincing Developers to Invest in Art

01:05:08 Advice for Emerging Public Artists

01:24:53 Current and Upcoming Projects

01:26:08 Where to Find More Information

Tilt Industrial Design: https://tilt-industrialdesign.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/tiltindustrialdesign

Also mentioned in this episode:

ResMed: https://shop.resmed.com.au/ | https://www.instagram.com/resmedanz/ | @resmedanz5242

BOC: https://www.boc.com.au/shop/en/au/home | @boclimited

Tim Phillips: https://tilt-industrialdesign.com/news-media/media/tilts-tim-phillips-managing-director-featured-in-boutique-developer/ | https://www.linkedin.com/in/timphillipsdesigns/

Ateliers Jean Nouvel: https://www.jeannouvel.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/ateliersjeannouvel/

Yann Kersale: https://yannkersale.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/yannkersale/ | @studioyannkersale

Reko Rennie: https://rekorennie.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/rekorennie/

Barbara Flynn: https://barbaraflynn.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/barbaraflynnptyltd/

Test Sites: https://www.melbourne.vic.gov.au/public-art-test-sites-program | https://www.instagram.com/publicartmelbourne/

Sculpture By The Sea: https://sculpturebythesea.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/sculpturebythesea | @sculpturebythesea

Vivid Sydney: https://www.vividsydney.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/vividsydney/ | @vividsydney

Placemaking NSW: https://www.planning.nsw.gov.au/about-us/our-work/placemaking-nsw

Art And About: https://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/art-about | https://www.instagram.com/cityofsydney | @CityofSydney

Kilometre of Sculpture: https://www.facebook.com/KilometreofSculpture/?profile_tab_item_selected=mentions&_rdr

NAVA: https://visualarts.net.au/ | https://www.instagram.com/nava_visualarts/

Janet Laurence: https://www.janetlaurence.com/ | https://www.instagram.com/janetlaurence/

ASPECT Studios: https://www.aspect-studios.com/au/ | https://www.instagram.com/aspectstudios

Warren Langley: https://www.warrenlangley.com.au/ | https://www.instagram.com/warren_langley_artist/

Jacob Nash: https://www.jacobnashdesign.com/

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

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📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: www.installationartpodcast.com

Your host Anastasia Parmson: www.anastasiaparmson.art | https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

🗣️ Join the conversation in our Linkedin group The Installation Art Society, a space for conversations about installation art and a platform for practitioners to share insights, discuss technical aspects, and exchange behind-the-scenes stories:

https://www.linkedin.com/groups/14532340/

Mentioned in this episode:

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In this episode, we sit down with Belgian artist Lawrence Malstaf, whose innovative work exists at the fascinating intersection of visual art, performance, and theatrical experience. Based in Tromsø, Norway, Malstaf has earned international acclaim for his immersive installations that transform viewers into active participants.

Episode Highlights:

• Lawrence shares his journey from studying industrial design (rather than fine art at his parents' suggestion) to discovering how this technical background gave him invaluable skills in working with contemporary materials.

• We discuss Malstaf’s famous vacuum piece "Shrink" (1995), where participants are sealed between plastic sheets while air is slowly removed, creating both a striking visual image and physical experience that differs dramatically for viewers versus participants.

• His recent focus on sustainable art practices and an innovative project creating "hotels" for endangered kittiwake seagulls in Tromsø, transforming an urban nuisance into an interspecies art project.

02:44 Quick Questions

05:27 Childhood and Early Influences

07:51 Industrial Design and Artistic Beginnings

09:46 Theater and Installation Art

16:41 Creating Opportunities and Multidisciplinary Spaces

21:50 Sustainable Art and Seagull Project

25:16 Audience Interaction and Physical Experience

29:19 Behind The Scenes Challenges

32:48 Artistic Evolution and Viral Fame

38:22 Sustainable Art Practices

41:48 Income From Art

44:27 Proudest Moments and Career Reflections

47:42 Advice for Emerging Artists

49:44 Internship Opportunity

51:48 Dream Projects

58:46 Where to Find More Information

Lawrence Malstaf (b. 1972, Bruges, Belgium) is based in Tromsø, Norway. He creates installation and performance art that exists at the borderline between visual arts and theatrical experience. With a focus on movement, coincidence, order and chaos, he develops immersive sensorial environments that often position visitors as co-actors in the artwork. His background in industrial design informs his technical approach to materials and mechanisms, while his experience in scenography for dance and theater influences the performative aspects of his installations.

You can find out more about his work on his website: https://www.lawrencemalstaf.com/ and get the latest updates on his Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lawrencemalstaf/

Malstaf is represented by Tallieu Art Office: https://www.artoffice.be/artists/lawrence-malstaf/

All images courtesy of the artist.

Also mentioned in this episode:

Ischa Tallieu: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ischatallieu/?originalSubdomain=be

Tailleu Art Office: https://www.artoffice.be/ | https://www.instagram.com/tallieu_art

Bains Connective in Brussels: https://www.artfactories.net/Les-Bains-Connective-Bruxelles.html

Frankfurter Kunstverein: https://www.fkv.de/en/ | https://www.instagram.com/frankfurterkunstverein/ | @FrankfurterKunstverein

FILE Festival for Electronic Languages: https://file.org.br/ https://www.instagram.com/filefestival/

Paola Perissinotto: https://digitalartarchive.at/database/artist/1340/

Delphin Ruché: https://www.rissa-cs.org/ | https://www.instagram.com/rissa_citizen_science/

The Installation Art Podcast is a show about people who love and work with the contemporary art medium of installation. The host Anastasia Parmson, an artist herself, interviews internationally renowned artists and arts workers about the intricacies and behind-the-scenes stories of creating and showing work that is site-specific, ephemeral, large scale or immersive.

🔔 Hit subscribe or follow wherever you’re listening to never miss a new episode.

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📚 More information about the show and previous episodes: www.installationartpodcast.com

Your host Anastasia Parmson: https://www.anastasiaparmson.art | https://www.instagram.com/anastasiaparmson.art/

🗣️ Join the conversation in our Linkedin group The Installation Art Society, a space for conversations about installation art and a platform for practitioners to share insights, discuss technical aspects, and exchange behind-the-scenes stories:

https://www.linkedin.com/groups/14532340/

Mentioned in this episode:

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