The Lawyer's Edge

Candisse Williamson is a highly accomplished General Counsel known for her creative deal-making and extensive legal expertise across the entertainment and corporate sectors. After graduating from Northwestern Law, she refined her corporate law skills, with a focus on M&A and private equity, at prestigious firms including Paul Weiss and King & Spalding. Her career then transitioned to entertainment, where she served as VP of Business and Legal Affairs at The Madison Square Garden Company, notably as lead attorney for the renowned Christmas Spectacular Starring the Radio City Rockettes.

Later, as General Counsel at Skybound Entertainment, Candisse built the company's legal department from the ground up, overseeing all transactions in film, TV, and gaming. She is now the GC of Hartbeat, actor and comedian Kevin Hart's media company. In this role, she established the legal department and now drives strategic deal-making across film, TV, audio, live events, and branded content, all while serving as a key member of the executive team.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT BUILDING LEGAL TEAMS AND MANAGING OUTSIDE COUNSEL

Most lawyers follow predictable career paths, but some find themselves in industries where the landscape shifts constantly. Candisse Williamson made the transition from corporate M&A at top firms to building legal departments in entertainment companies, where deal structures evolve rapidly and traditional contracts often don't fit.

As General Counsel at Hartbeat, Kevin Hart's media company, Candisse has learned that success requires more than legal expertise. She's built two legal departments from the ground up, developed strategies for working effectively with outside counsel, and discovered that understanding the business is often more important than perfecting the legal details.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman speaks with Candisse about her journey from Big Law to entertainment, how she approaches building and managing legal teams, and practical advice for lawyers looking to work with entertainment companies.

2:34 - Why Candisse wanted a legal career and her transition into entertainment law

5:30 - The biggest challenge for Candisse as VP/General Counsel

8:06 - How Candisse built Hartbeat's legal department from the ground up

11:09 - Two main purposes of outside counsel and how Candisse maintains relationships

13:56 - Candisse's philosophy about handling difficult conversations with outside counsel

16:52 - How you can rise above the crowded field and grow a book of business as a private practice lawyer

23:18 - Why Candisse emphasizes diversity in her staffing decisions

25:43 - Challenges in the constantly evolving world of entertainment and media

30:03 - Candisse's personality and adaptability as an attorney

33:53 - Highly critical advice for in-house counsel

MENTIONED IN STRATEGY AND TALENT: HOW ONE GENERAL COUNSEL BUILDS LEGAL TEAMS AND CHOOSES OUTSIDE COUNSEL

Hartbeat | LinkedIn | Instagram

Laugh Out Loud Network: YouTube | TikTok | Instagram | Facebook | Snapchat | Twitter/X

Anthony Desimone | Making AI Work For Your Law Firm Without Compromising Security or Excellence

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE...

Today's episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm which has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008.

Each member of The Lawyer's Edge coaching team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach AND either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional. Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress.

To get connected with YOUR coach, just email the team at hello@thelawyersedge.com.

Megan Morgan is a principal in the Baltimore office of Beveridge & Diamond, a national environmental law firm, where she is an environmental litigator and business counselor with a practice focused on the waste and recycling industry. She leads litigation teams on some of the firm's largest and most critical environmental cases, representing clients in court and before regulatory agencies across the country on permitting challenges, enforcement actions, class actions, and citizen suits. Megan has developed particular expertise in odor and nuisance litigation involving landfills and other waste facilities. She also co-chairs the firm's ESG & Sustainability practice. In 2025, Megan received Waste360's 40 Under 40 Award, and in 2024, Law360 named her a Rising Star in environmental law. She earned her law degree magna cum laude from the University of Maryland School of Law and an MBA from Georgetown University.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT BUILDING A LEGAL PRACTICE THROUGH INDUSTRY SPECIALIZATION

When it comes to attracting clients, lawyers often worry that narrowing their focus will mean leaving opportunities on the table. For litigators especially, becoming known for one type of work can feel risky when they're capable of handling a much broader range of matters. Yet focusing on a particular industry doesn't necessarily mean narrowing the work itself. The depth of knowledge that comes from understanding an industry's legal issues and the challenges its businesses face can create opportunities to serve clients across a wide range of matters.

That industry knowledge becomes even more valuable when lawyers invest in the relationships and visibility that make them a familiar presence within the industry. Understanding what matters to clients beyond the immediate legal issue helps build the trust that leads to additional work, while staying involved in industry conversations helps ensure prospective clients know whom to call when a need arises. The more familiar lawyers become with their clients' businesses, the better equipped they are to recognize their needs and connect them with the right expertise.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Megan Morgan of Beveridge & Diamond about building a legal practice through industry specialization and developing trusted client relationships that lead to more work. They also discuss how industry involvement creates new business development opportunities and how Megan balances growing her practice with the demands of client work.

3:12 - Why Megan chose to specialize in the waste and recycling industry

4:25 - Finding variety within a narrow industry niche

6:21 - Bringing in colleagues to serve clients beyond your own expertise

8:38 - Building client trust that leads to additional work

10:12 - Developing business from existing firm relationships as an associate

13:02 - Becoming the lawyer prospective clients know to call

16:22 - Balancing existing client relationships with new business development

17:47 - Turning conference connections into new work

19:14 - Making conferences more productive through preparation and follow-up

22:30 - Using marketing teams, associates, and partners to support business development

25:06 - Balancing a second practice area with industry specialization

27:28 - How an MBA shaped Megan's understanding of the business of law

29:57 - Understanding clients' financial priorities and business concerns

33:00 - Building stronger client relationships outside the office

35:23 - Why developing a niche practice requires being in the room

MENTIONED IN BUILDING A LEGAL PRACTICE THROUGH INDUSTRY SPECIALIZATION

Beveridge & Diamond PC | LinkedIn

Megan Morgan on LinkedIn

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Charlie Jimerson is the founder and CEO of Jimerson Birr, a Florida-based business law firm with a national reputation for litigation, regulatory, and transactional work. He's also a U.S. Air Force veteran, a board-certified construction law attorney, and a widely recognized leader in the legal and business communities. Under his leadership, the firm has been repeatedly honored for its workplace culture, growth, and client service while representing various businesses of all sizes and scales as their go-to counsel for legal matters and comprehensive legal expertise, both inside and outside the courtroom.

From drafting and enforcing contracts, providing grounded executive-level advice, and collecting money owed, Charlie's extensive experience spans all phases of litigation, including alternative dispute resolution, settlement negotiations, and complex commercial cases. His career is distinguished by a rich tapestry of accomplishments that mirror his unwavering commitment to securing favorable outcomes for his clients and reflect a focus on service, quality, and results.

Prior to founding Jimerson Birr, Charlie honed his skills and expertise at prominent Jacksonville-based commercial litigation and construction law boutique law firms. He currently resides in Ortega with his wife, Ashley, their two children, and their Italian Greyhound dog, Olive.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT LAW FIRM GROWTH

As a young lawyer, Charlie Jimerson had his pick of opportunities and began his career at a traditional Biglaw firm. But it didn't take long for him to feel disenchanted with what he saw—an industry clinging to outdated models that didn't truly serve clients. Not even four years into practice, Charlie founded Jimerson Birr as a values-driven law firm committed to doing things differently.

He believed law firms could grow by focusing on service, quality, and results instead of billable hours and burnout. That conviction shaped his approach to building a practice centered on client needs, predictable pricing, and strong culture. By replacing outdated habits with clear processes and accountability, Charlie set out to prove that sustainable growth is possible without sacrificing relationships or outcomes.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise talks with Charlie about how rethinking the billable hour can fuel law firm growth. He shares how subscription pricing and disciplined processes create more value for clients, how AI can enhance efficiency without replacing human judgment, and why culture and leadership are essential to long-term success. Charlie also explains why he sees pressure as a privilege and why "the way it's always been done" is the most dangerous mindset holding firms back.

2:06 - The inspiration for Jimerson Birr's founding and identity

5:21 - Problems with the billable hours model of many legal organizations

9:12 - What's necessary for the legal industry to start retreating from the billable hour crutch

14:37 – Value-based and subscription pricing around four core areas and three package tiers

21:15 – Why there should still be room made for the billable hour when necessary

24:56 - Three biggest things learned from client surveys that impacted changes within the firm

27:43 - How Charlie uses AI to enhance his organization's practice

32:20 - Hiring principles and cultural philosophy of Jimerson Birr

34:45 – Why Charlie views pressure as a privilege and its impact on his choices

37:28 - Essentials to focus on and the mentality law firm leaders need to reject so the industry can evolve

MENTIONED IN RETHINKING THE BILLABLE HOUR FOR SUSTAINABLE LAW FIRM GROWTH

Jimerson Birr | LinkedIn | Facebook | Instagram | Youtube

Follow Charlie B. Jimerson on LinkedIn

Process! How Discipline and Consistency Will Set You and Your Business Free by Mike Paton and Lisa González

Books by Gino Wickman

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Damien Weinstein is the Co-Founder and Managing Partner of Weinstein + Klein, a Morristown, New Jersey law firm representing small and mid-sized businesses in corporate transactions and employment matters. He leads the firm's business and transaction group, where his work focuses on M&A, partnerships, and complex commercial agreements. Since founding Weinstein + Klein with Brian Klein in 2019, Damien has helped grow the firm from two people to approximately 25. The firm has appeared twice on the Inc. 5000 list of fastest-growing private companies, most recently ranking No. 622, and was named to the 2026 Inc. Best Workplaces list. As both a lawyer and business owner, Damien takes an "advisor first, lawyer second" approach to client work, bringing a practical business perspective to the legal issues his clients face. He has also been recognized as a Super Lawyers Rising Star every year since 2018 and has been featured in The Wall Street Journal and the New York Law Journal.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT RUNNING A LAW FIRM LIKE A BUSINESS

Lawyers spend a lot of time helping clients grow, hire well, and build businesses that can last. Turning that same attention toward their own firms can be much harder. Once a practice starts growing, the work is no longer just about serving clients and practicing law well. Firm leaders also have to make decisions about people, capacity, profitability, culture, and business development, often without having been taught how to do any of it.

Damien Weinstein learned that firsthand as the firm he started with his partner grew from two people to about 25. What began as two lawyers working side by side had to become a true business, which meant hiring sooner, building operational support, creating systems, and becoming much more intentional about culture and client relationships. That experience has also changed the way Damien advises clients by pushing him to look beyond the immediate legal issues and understand what the client is trying to accomplish with the business.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Damien Weinstein of Weinstein + Klein about what changes when lawyers start thinking like business owners. They discuss the decisions that supported his firm's growth, the role of hiring and operational support, how to protect culture as a team expands, and why a stronger understanding of business can make lawyers better advisors to their clients.

2:49 - Starting a law firm without knowing how to run one

5:18 - The mindset shift from practicing lawyer to business owner

8:45 - Learning from clients and other business owners

10:24 - Risk tolerance, hiring, and creating more capacity

11:53 - Hiring sooner and building the systems to support growth

13:26 - The role of non-lawyer professionals in running the firm

15:24 - Protecting culture as the team grows

19:42 - Screening for cultural fit during the hiring process

22:34 - Giving junior lawyers autonomy, feedback, and clear expectations

24:47 - Becoming an advisor first and a lawyer second

28:38 - Preparing business owners earlier for a successful sale

30:50 - Understanding the seller before negotiating the deal

34:04 - Surrounding yourself with the right people and advisors

35:18 - The difference between calling yourself a trusted advisor and actually being one

MENTIONED IN WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU RUN YOUR LAW FIRM LIKE YOUR CLIENTS RUN THEIR BUSINESSES

Weinstein + Klein | LinkedIn

Damien Weinstein on LinkedIn

Unreasonable Hospitality by Will Guidara

Radical Candor by Kim Scott

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Business development can often feel daunting. Even lawyers who recognize its importance frequently grapple with where to begin and how to execute effectively. Without a well-defined strategy, it's easy to become overwhelmed, discouraged, and ultimately disengage from the process.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman breaks down the process with her 3 Pillars of Business Development—a proven, straightforward framework that gives attorneys the clarity, tools, and focus necessary to build a thriving book of business. By applying these pillars, you'll be able to channel your time and energy into high-impact activities, making business development less intimidating and far more rewarding.

Tune in to discover how you can make BD a manageable and achievable part of your practice—and start seeing the results you've been aiming for.

This is an episode you won't want to miss!

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT FOR LAWYERS

1:48 - Four reasons why I developed the three pillars of business development success and a quick rundown of what they are

10:30 - How to actively nurture and grow relationships with clients and prospects

13:12 - How to establish credibility and position yourself as an authority in your field

16:58 - The three Ts of leadership advancement and how they contribute to effective business development in legal

23:29 - How to use the pillars to grow and advance into a consistent business developer or rainmaker for your law firm

28:30 - The curse of knowledge about business development I have that I want to share with you

MENTIONED IN 3 ESSENTIAL PILLARS OF BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT FOR LAWYERS

Myers-Brigg | TypeCoach Verifier

"How to Cultivate a Business Development Mindset"

Get Connected with The Coaching Team at hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE…

Today's episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm which has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008.

Each member of The Lawyer's Edge coaching team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach AND either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional. Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress.

To get connected with YOUR coach, just email the team at hello@thelawyersedge.com.

Dr. Larry Richard is recognized as a leading expert on the psychology of lawyer behavior and the use of behavioral science to improve performance in law firms and legal departments. A graduate of the University of Pennsylvania Law School, he practiced as a litigator for 10 years before earning his PhD in psychology from Temple University. Since then, he has gathered and analyzed personality data on thousands of lawyers and consulted with hundreds of law firms and corporate legal departments on resilience, leadership development, change management, and lawyer well-being. He is the founder of LawyerBrain and co-author, with Dr. D'Arcy Lyness, of Thin Skinned: Why Lawyers Are So Low in Resilience and the New Science That Can Help.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT BUILDING RESILIENCE IN THE LEGAL PROFESSION

Lawyers are trained to think critically about what could go wrong, and that mindset serves them well in practice. The challenge is that it does not always switch off when the immediate problem is solved or the workday ends. When pressure becomes constant, that way of thinking can make it harder to recover from setbacks and get back to a steadier place.

Dr. Larry Richard has spent decades studying why resilience can be such a challenge for lawyers. His research shows that resilience is largely learned, which also means it can be strengthened. Understanding that opens the door to looking more closely at the habits and responses that wear resilience down and what lawyers can do differently over time.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Dr. Larry Richard of LawyerBrain about why lawyers tend to score low in resilience, how personality traits affect the way they respond to stress and change, what helps build resilience over time, and how lawyers can better manage the traits that make them effective at their work.

2:52 - What constant change does to the brain's threat response

6:09 - Why lawyer personality can make adapting to change harder

11:39 - Which lawyer traits are learned and which are largely genetic

14:35 - How legal training reinforces skepticism

16:49 - The difference between fixed traits and improvable resilience

18:58 - What resilience actually looks like in practice

21:02 - How low resilience changes the way criticism is experienced

24:06 - The connection between isolation and resilience

28:11 - When the traits that help lawyers succeed start working against them

30:46 - Four areas lawyers can focus on to strengthen resilience

31:26 - Replacing catastrophizing with realistic optimism

35:33 - Why positive emotions matter more than lawyers may think

41:03 - Building resilience through stronger relationships and presence

43:43 - How self-care supports the other resilience strategies

46:17 - Learning to use lawyer traits without letting them take over

Mentioned In How Lawyers Can Build Greater Resilience

LawyerBrain LLC

Dr. Larry Richard on LinkedIn

Dr. Larry Richard | The "Lawyer Personality" and Becoming a Happier Lawyer

Thin-Skinned: Why Lawyers Are So Low in Resilience and the New Science That Can Help

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Many lawyers dismiss conferences as a drain on time and money. And frankly, they're right—unless you know how to make the most of them. With the right approach, conferences can transform from missed opportunities into a cornerstone of your business development strategy.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman shares actionable insights on how to unlock the full potential of industry conferences. She provides a clear, step-by-step roadmap for maximizing every phase of the event, ensuring your efforts yield measurable results. Discover how to turn conference attendance into a powerful tool for rainmaking and client attraction.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT GETTING THE MOST ROI FROM CONFERENCES

2:29 - Two primary reasons why conferences are worth attending from a business development perspective

5:46 - Some of the potential downsides to attending industry conferences and why it's worth looking at this issue

7:53 - Intentional questions to ask yourself before going to your next conference so you can wring every bit of value possible out of attending

13:32 - How to create a timeline and take action before the conference (and how most approach this incorrectly)

18:28 - The importance of setting aside time to recharge (especially if you're an introvert)

20:38 - Timeline creation and actions to consider taking during your next conference (including how to exit uncomfortable conversations gracefully)

23:03 - How to handle the aftermath of a conference and why people lose a tremendous amount of opportunity at this stage

26:14 - A consideration once you determine a conference is a good fit for you and a brief word about raising your profile at conferences

MENTIONED IN HOW TO GET THE MOST ROI FROM YOUR NEXT CONFERENCE

3 Essential Pillars of Business Development for Lawyers

Managing Partner Forum

John Remsen | Essential Characteristics of Effective Law Firm Leaders

Legal Marketing Association

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Brenda A. Barnes, CPA, MBA, is the founder of Brenda Barnes Consulting, where she works with law firm leaders on compensation design, succession planning, and financial strategy. She brings more than 35 years of experience in law firm financial management to her role, including serving as a law firm administrator in Austin, Texas. Brenda previously founded B2 Legal Management, an outsourced accounting and billing firm serving solo to midsize law firms across the U.S., which she built and sold in 2021. She is a former president of the Austin Chapter of the Association of Legal Administrators and co-author of RESPECT – An Insight to Attorney Compensation Plans, now in its second edition.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT LAW FIRM COMPENSATION AND RETENTION

Compensation touches almost every challenge law firms are facing right now, from recruiting and retention to leadership development and succession planning. Yet many firms are still relying on systems that evolved internally over time, with younger lawyers expected to understand how they advance, what the firm values, and what opportunities are available to them without anyone clearly defining it.

The firms being more intentional about compensation are putting structure around those decisions. They are writing down the criteria, defining what advancement looks like, creating more flexible career paths, and looking beyond billable hours when deciding what contributions should be rewarded. They are also treating compensation plans as systems that need to change as the firm's priorities change, rather than something to put in place once and leave alone.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Brenda Barnes of Brenda Barnes Consulting about why compensation has become such a critical issue for law firms, what younger lawyers are looking for when they ask for transparency, how associate and partner compensation systems are changing, and how compensation decisions shape retention and succession planning.

3:10 - Compensation as a strategic issue for law firms

5:30 - What transparency actually means to younger lawyers

7:40 - Clarity as a retention strategy

12:57 - The connection between compensation and respect

14:27 - Different approaches to associate and partner compensation

16:03 - Current compensation trends in small and midsize firms

17:23 - Flexible career paths for lawyers who do not want equity

20:06 - The compensation problems that bring law firms looking for help

24:16 - How level-based associate compensation systems work

29:06 - Customizing compensation to reward the behaviors a firm values

30:17 - Looking beyond billable hours to law firm economics and collections

32:58 - How origination credit affects succession planning

38:09 - Why firms eventually become what their compensation systems reward

Mentioned In How Law Firm Compensation Shapes Retention and Succession

Brenda Barnes Consulting

Brenda Barnes on LinkedIn

RESPECT – An Insight to Attorney Compensation Plans

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Shannon Lombardo is the Director of Business Development at Saul Ewing LLP, a national law firm with more than 400 attorneys. She leads strategic growth initiatives focused on attorney business development coaching, client relationship development, and revenue generation. With extensive experience in legal marketing and business development, Shannon partners with attorneys and law firms to build stronger relationships, identify growth opportunities, and achieve their business objectives.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT FOLLOW-THROUGH

Lawyers may understand that business development matters and genuinely intend to make it a priority, but that intention often gets pushed aside by client work, billable-hour demands, and the discomfort of doing something that does not feel as familiar as practicing law. Even lawyers who want to build business can struggle with where to start, how to stay consistent, and how to keep going when the results take time.

That means firms have to look beyond simply teaching lawyers what to do. More training will not solve a problem rooted in discomfort, lack of confidence, competing priorities, or a lawyer who is not ready to engage. The real opportunity is understanding what is actually getting in the way, then creating the right level of support and accountability to help lawyers take action in a way that fits them.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Shannon Lombardo of Saul Ewing LLP about why lawyers struggle to follow through on business development, what makes business development training more effective, how accountability supports consistency, and where responsibility lies between the firm and the individual lawyer.

2:12 - Why lawyers struggle to prioritize business development

5:34 - How unrealistic rainmaker examples can discourage lawyers

8:35 - How to assess whether a lawyer is ready for business development support

11:01 - Building a business development plan around the individual lawyer

14:58 - Why Saul Ewing moved away from one-off training programs

18:14 - Why one-time business development training rarely changes behavior

22:21 - Matching business development support to the individual lawyer

24:51 - The psychology behind business development resistance

27:28 - What internal business development teams can and cannot own

29:32 - Using accountability to help lawyers stay consistent

31:48 - Why small, consistent business development actions matter

32:56 - What disengagement from coaching may actually signal

Mentioned In The Gap Between Wanting to Do Business Development and Actually Doing It

Saul Ewing LLP | LinkedIn

Shannon Lombardo on LinkedIn

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Michael Mellor is the President and Founder of 742 Advisors, a boutique consultancy focused on law firm revenue generation, pitch operations, and go-to-market strategy. He designs revenue operating models that help firms win more work with less friction, covering pitch infrastructure, business development operations, experience management systems, and governance frameworks. Before founding 742 Advisors, Mike served as Chief Marketing and Business Development Officer at Pryor Cashman, where he rebuilt the firm's marketing department and transformed the function from a cost center into a revenue-generating operation. He previously held senior roles at Paul Weiss and Katten and served on KPMG's "Big Deal" team, leading pursuit strategy for some of the firm's largest opportunities. Mike has been recognized by Lawdragon as a Top 100 Global Leader in Legal Strategy & Consulting and received the Legal Marketing Association New York Chapter's Member of the Year Award.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT USING BETTER DATA FOR LAW FIRM BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT

Law firms can have exactly the sort of experience a prospective client is looking for and still have trouble finding it or remembering it when they need it. The information may be sitting in an old pitch, missing from an attorney bio, coded incorrectly in a firm system, or known only to the lawyer who handled the work. That creates a very practical business development problem when it is time to show a prospect what the firm has actually done.

Michael Mellor has spent his career inside law firms looking at why those gaps exist and how firms can close them. His approach starts with getting a clearer picture of the work lawyers have already done, then organizing that information in a way people can actually use. That can make business development easier without requiring another major technology investment and give firm leaders a more accurate view of where the firm has depth and where there may be room to grow.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge Podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Michael Mellor of 742 Advisors about the information gaps that make business development harder, how law firm culture and incentives affect whether systems actually get used, why better data matters beyond individual pitches, and practical ways firms can start organizing what they already know without making another major technology investment.

3:27 - What the scramble for law firm experience looks like during a pitch

5:28 - Why centralized information matters beyond individual pitches

6:44 - How poor data hygiene affects law firm strategy

8:44 - Auditing lawyers' work to uncover business development opportunities

12:09 - Why business development plans often become a box-checking exercise

14:46 - Why law firm CRMs fail to solve the information problem

18:51 - How origination credit and compensation affect information sharing

22:39 - Starting small with attorney bios and existing matter information

24:27 - Building a useful database before investing in more technology

26:46 - Why lawyers need to document the work they have already done

MENTIONED IN HOW BETTER DATA CAN HELP LAW FIRMS WIN MORE WORK

742 Advisors | LinkedIn

Michael Mellor on LinkedIn

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Michelle Citrin is the owner of Michelle Citrin Studios, a personal branding and photography practice focused exclusively on women in law. She has more than 17 years of experience in photography and earned her degree from the Savannah College of Art and Design. Michelle also brings a background in fashion styling and design to her work, which she uses to help attorneys show up with the same authority they have earned in the courtroom or boardroom. She operates studios in Fort Lauderdale, Charlotte, and Asheville and works with clients around the world. Her work has been featured in Forbes, Ocean Drive Magazine, and NBC6, and she teaches continuing legal education programs across Florida on marketing, executive presence, and personal branding.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT HEADSHOTS AS A BUSINESS STRATEGY

For many lawyers, professional photography is something to check off the list when it is time to update a website bio or LinkedIn profile. That approach misses how much your imagery shapes the perception people form when they look you up. If your headshot no longer reflects your current level of experience, authority, and success, there can be a disconnect between the reputation you have earned and the way you are showing up online.

This is why Michelle Citrin approaches professional photography as an important part of a lawyer's larger marketing and visibility strategy. Your face is often the most recognizable part of your brand, and the images you use can help you stay memorable and top of mind while giving you more control over the narrative people encounter online. As AI changes how professionals market themselves, being human, using real imagery, and showing up as yourself become even more important to building trust.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge Podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Michelle Citrin of Michelle Citrin Studios about using professional photography as a marketing strategy, matching your imagery to the authority you have earned, building visibility and trust online, and being human in a world of AI.

3:19 - What strong personal brands have in common

4:41 - Showing up consistently without being "loud"

6:31 - Treating professional photography as a marketing strategy

8:19 - Why your face is the most recognizable part of your brand

9:20 - Matching your imagery to your current level of authority

12:21 - Making your expertise more visible and staying top of mind

15:32 - Why accomplished lawyers can still feel uncomfortable in front of the camera

20:11 - Choosing a photographer who understands your audience and marketing goals

21:16 - Planning imagery around your target market and message

24:05 - Being human in a world of AI

26:36 - Building trust when clients are finding and vetting lawyers online

28:45 - Updating your photography regularly and continuing to show up

Mentioned In Why Your Headshot Is a Business Strategy, Not a Vanity Project

Michelle Citrin Studios

Michelle Citrin on LinkedIn

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Michael Roch is the founder and principal advisor of MHPR Advisors, where he advises managing partners, boards, and remuneration committees on partner compensation and governance. For more than 25 years, he has worked with law firm leaders across Australia, Canada, the United Kingdom, Europe, and the United States, as well as with accounting, consulting, and other professional partnerships. Originally trained as both an accountant and a lawyer, Michael brings a cross-disciplinary perspective to questions involving compensation, governance, finance, and tax. He is the co-author of The Partner Remuneration Handbook and co-leads a long-running global survey tracking how partners are paid across markets. Based in Zurich, Michael serves clients worldwide.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT PARTNER COMPENSATION AND LAW FIRM STRATEGY

Law firm leaders often believe their compensation system reflects what they are trying to build. Yet the way partners are paid may still reward them for holding tightly to client relationships, prioritizing their own originations, and resisting the collaboration the partnership says it values. As the business grows across offices and practice areas, those old approaches can become increasingly disconnected from where the firm is going.

Michael Roch explains that this often happens because partnerships fail to update compensation systems developed when they were much smaller. Changing the system requires leaders to be clear about what the business is trying to achieve and willing to let go of old paradigms that no longer support that direction. It also requires a closer look at what the partnership actually rewards, how partner contributions are evaluated, and whether the decision-making process reinforces the strategy or works against it.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge Podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Michael Roch of MHPR Advisors about why compensation systems fall behind as firms grow, how origination credit can create conflict around client relationships, what firms should consider when compensating managing partners and other leaders, and why money is only one of the tools law firm leaders can use to influence behavior and retain talent.

3:45 - The three elements that shape a partner compensation system

5:20 - Why compensation systems fall behind as firms grow

10:19 - What a firm's compensation system reveals about its real values

14:58 - Why annual compensation memos cannot replace ongoing performance dialogue

20:13 - Origination credit, collaboration, and control of client relationships

24:23 - Putting rules and governance around origination disputes

28:38 - How firms should compensate managing partners and practice group leaders

35:16 - Why paying more rarely solves a retention problem

38:21 - The leadership responsibility partners have to associates and counsel

40:08 - Why reward involves more than compensation

Mentioned In How Partner Compensation Can Undermine Your Firm's Strategy

MHPR Advisors | LinkedIn

Michael Roch on LinkedIn

The Partner Remuneration Handbook by Michael Roch and Ray D'Cruz

SmarterReward™

Dr. Heidi Gardner | How Law Firms Can Increase Revenues, Grow Client Loyalty, and Improve Diversity

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

What do you think is one of the most powerful obstacles to business development success for lawyers?

Despite their busy schedules, it isn't a lack of time. It's not about the lack of money, either. It's not even that you don't know how to do it, although law school certainly didn't teach it.

Simply put, it's your mindset. It's the stories you tell yourself that stop you from taking (or fully committing to) consistent, targeted action. And it's the biggest impediment I've come across again and again with lawyers I meet.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, you'll learn 7 tips that will help you cultivate a successful business development mindset. I'll teach you a thought process that will inspire you to start taking action in the direction of your goals and stick with it consistently!

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT CULTIVATING A BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT MINDSET

2:57 - What business development success and that criminal law class you took in your first year have in common

5:27 - The first thing you can do to cultivate your business development mindset for success

8:14 - Two things you need to recognize about business development and one thing you shouldn't expect to see

11:26 - The people you shouldn't listen to and the responses you don't want to give to everyone else and yourself

14:12 - A change that'll make it more likely for you to focus on and engage with business development

Mentioned In How to Cultivate a Business Development Mindset

IGNITE Women's Business Development Accelerator

Get Connected with The Coaching Team at hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE…

Today's episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm which has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008.

Each member of The Lawyer's Edge coaching team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach AND either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional. Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress.

To get connected with YOUR coach, just email the team at hello@thelawyersedge.com.

Joshua Wurtzel is a commercial and real estate litigation partner at Schlam Stone & Dolan LLP, a Manhattan boutique law firm that represents businesses, non-profits, and individuals in complex and corporate matters. He has successfully represented public and private companies and prominent individuals in both federal and state court. With his focus on aggressive litigation and his ability to develop creative and novel solutions to complex disputes, he brings a unique, out-of-the-box perspective to his clients' most pressing legal needs.

Before joining Schlam Stone & Dolan, Josh was an associate at Weil, Gotshal & Manges LLP in its Securities Litigation and Corporate Governance group. He also previously worked as an intern for the Honorable Kiyo A. Matsumoto of the Eastern District of New York. He's a regular contributor to several legal publications (such as the New York Law Journal) and lectures on cutting-edge legal issues in the commercial real estate sector.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT HOW TO GET STARTED AS A RAINMAKER - AND SUCCEED!

Bringing new clients into a law firm not only drives a law firm's growth, but can also provide you with greater professional autonomy and an increased ability to call the shots in your own career. Despite the clear benefits to becoming a consistent business developer, many lawyers don't pursue business development success or struggle to achieve it.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman sits down with Joshua Wurtzel, a commercial and real estate litigation partner at Schlam Stone & Dolan LLP, to discuss his experience with building a book of business. Josh shares the challenges he faced on his journey to becoming a rainmaker and explains how networking and coaching have been instrumental in refining his approach to business development, team-building, and client relationships.

2:50 - Why Josh decided to start building his book of business and the early challenges and successes he encountered

6:22 - The impact of developing his book of business on Josh's approach to client relationships

9:18 - How Josh landed his first clients and honed his networking skills

11:42 - The importance of building trust over time and different strategies for developing lasting relationships

15:22 - The business development challenges that Josh continues to focus on overcoming

18:23 - How Josh has adapted his business development strategies over time and why he prioritizes business development

25:02 - How Josh maintains the momentum of his business development efforts when immediate results don't materialize

28:07 - The importance of building a team to support business development and manage client relationships

33:59 - Advice for associates, counsel, and junior partners looking to start building their own book of business and advance in their careers

38:29 - The role of self-confidence and belief in your success as a lawyer and aspiring rainmaker

MENTIONED IN HOW TO GET STARTED AS A RAINMAKER - AND SUCCEED!

Schlam Stone & Dolan LLP | Joshua's Profile

Joshua Wurtzel on LinkedIn

Joshua Wurtzel on Instagram

Business Networking International (BNI)

USA 500 Clubs

Get Connected with The Coaching Team at hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Tara Stingley is a Partner of Cline Williams and the Chair of its Labor and Employment Law section. Cline Williams, established in 1857, is Nebraska's oldest existing law firm and is a full-service firm with approximately 60 lawyers working in 5 offices located in Nebraska and Colorado. Tara is the firm's primary representative to the Employment Law Alliance, the largest international network of labor and employment lawyers. Tara focuses her practice on employment law, advising businesses in various industries on compliance with federal, state, and local employment laws and regulations.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT BEING A VISIBILITY EXPERT AS A PRACTICING ATTORNEY

Those first travelers making their way West did so without a roadmap. But in taking the opportunity, they paved the way for the nation's expansion.

That spirit of the West is very much rooted in Tara Stingley and the Nebraska law firm of which she is a partner. As the first woman to serve on Cline Williams' executive committee, she challenged other members to think about how they defined issues and the impact of their decisions.

She also established her niche as an employment law expert within the legal community. Laying down that foundation has paid dividends in affording her opportunities, as it can for you, too. And unlike that first wave of westward travelers, you don't have to go forward blindly; Tara has tips to help you build your roadmap to greater visibility.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, you'll hear about the payoff potential in raising your profile and building your brand as a subject-matter expert and how to start proactively doing it (even if you're still a young lawyer). Tara will also discuss the importance of representation, the need for professional women to stop underestimating their value, what plays into a client's decision to pick you over others, and so much more!

1:51 - How Tara became a lawyer and partner at Cline Williams and how the law firm differs from others

9:51 - The importance of Tara's role as the first woman on the firm's executive committee

13:22 - Why you should strive to increase your visibility as an expert in your field, even when you can't see an immediate payoff

20:58 - How lawyers can create branding opportunities for themselves rather than wait for them to appear

25:06 - The mindset you need for approaching opportunities to raise your profile and ultimately get clients you want to work with

29:40 - An essential piece of advice for professional women (especially those dealing with imposter syndrome)

Mentioned In How to Become a Visible Expert in Your Practice Area

Cline Williams

Employment Law Alliance

Tara Stingley on LinkedIn

Get Connected with The Coaching Team at hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE…

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Leslie D. Davis is the Chief Executive Officer of the National Association of Minority and Women Owned Law Firms, Inc. (NAMWOLF), a nonprofit trade association that connects preeminent minority and women-owned law firms with corporations and public entities hiring outside counsel. Before taking the helm at NAMWOLF in 2021, Leslie spent 25 years as a trial lawyer and rainmaker, made partner at three firms, and served as lead counsel in complex jury trials, bench trials, and arbitrations. She is also a certified transformational leadership coach, sought-after speaker, mentor, and longtime advocate for equity in the legal profession. Leslie earned her J.D. from the University of Iowa College of Law and her M.A. and B.A. in Journalism and Mass Communication from the University of Iowa.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT HOW MINORITY AND WOMEN-OWNED FIRMS WIN CORPORATE WORK

Minority and women-owned law firms have been fighting for a seat at the corporate table for decades. The barrier has not been a lack of talent or capability. Outside counsel decisions have historically been shaped by connections, relationships, and familiarity, making it harder for firms outside those established networks to compete for corporate work.

NAMWOLF works to change that by connecting carefully vetted minority and women-owned firms with corporations and public entities hiring outside counsel. Its member firms are selected based on their reputation, experience, responsiveness, reliability, and ability to handle sophisticated legal work. The organization also creates opportunities for firms and in-house counsel to build real relationships while encouraging member firms to refer work to one another rather than compete for every opportunity.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Leslie Davis of NAMWOLF about how minority and women-owned firms win corporate work, why relationships remain central to outside counsel decisions, how NAMWOLF evaluates its member firms, and how the organization is responding to changing attitudes toward diversity.

2:51 - NAMWOLF's mission and the legal market it serves

4:30 - Why member firms collaborate instead of competing for every opportunity

6:50 - How NAMWOLF vets firms for sophisticated corporate legal work

9:06 - Creating relationships between member firms and corporate counsel

12:15 - Why Leslie left trial practice to lead NAMWOLF

14:21 - How litigation and rainmaking prepared Leslie for the CEO role

17:01 - Learning to lead professionals who are not lawyers

20:55 - Responding to the changing climate around DEI

25:04 - Staying focused when the conversation becomes a distraction

30:26 - Building real relationships that lead to business

MENTIONED IN HOW MINORITY AND WOMEN-OWNED FIRMS ARE WINNING CORPORATE WORK

NAMWOLF | LinkedIn

Leslie Davis on LinkedIn

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Emily Stedman is a commercial litigation partner at Husch Blackwell LLP in Milwaukee, where she handles complex business disputes from pre-suit negotiation through trial and appeal. With more than a decade of experience in practice, Emily brings both Big Law credibility and a practical understanding of what it takes to build a successful legal career without burning out. In addition to her litigation work, she is a nationally recognized advocate for lawyer well-being, known for her candid speaking, writing, and thought leadership on the mental health realities of modern legal practice. She has been recognized by Best Lawyers in America, Super Lawyers Rising Stars, and Corporate Counsel for her influence and leadership in the profession, including a Women, Influence, and Power in Law Award in the Mental Health and Well-Being Initiative category. She has also served on the Wisconsin Task Force on Lawyer Well-Being.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT LAW FIRM LEADERSHIP AND LAWYER WELL-BEING

Lawyer well-being is often treated as something individual attorneys have to manage on their own. Lawyers are told to set boundaries, manage stress, ask for help, and keep going. That advice may be useful, but it only goes so far when lawyers are also making assumptions about availability, visibility, and what it really takes to succeed inside a demanding law firm.

Emily Stedman is not arguing that Big Law should stop being demanding or that lawyers can build ambitious careers without working hard. Her point is more practical. If law firms want talented lawyers to stay, leaders need to be more honest about how sustainable careers are actually built, including the different ways lawyers can meet expectations, exercise autonomy, and model a life inside the profession that others can realistically imagine for themselves.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Emily Stedman of Husch Blackwell LLP about lawyer well-being as a leadership issue, the assumptions lawyers make about availability and visibility, the generational tensions around boundaries, and why leaders need to tell the truth about how they actually work.

3:22 - Why Emily started speaking openly about lawyer well-being

6:12 - Lateraling to Husch Blackwell and practicing more authentically

7:45 - What Emily changed about how she worked after joining a new firm

9:33 - Building a sustainable Big Law career while still meeting firm expectations

12:08 - The mindset shifts lawyers need before setting better boundaries

16:39 - What law firm leaders get right and wrong about well-being

19:43 - Why lawyer well-being does not mean avoiding hard work

21:23 - Why well-being requires better management conversations inside law firms

24:22 - The connection between everyday well-being, burnout, and mental health crises

29:07 - The one concrete thing law firm leaders can do to make a difference

34:14 - How leaders model autonomy, control, and sustainable careers for others

MENTIONED IN WHAT LAW FIRM LEADERS NEED TO UNDERSTAND ABOUT LAWYER WELL-BEING

Husch Blackwell LLP | LinkedIn

Emily Stedman | LinkedIn

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Travis Armstrong is the Chief Operating Officer of English, Lucas, Priest & Owsley, also known as ELPO, the largest full-service law firm in South Central Kentucky. He has managed the operations of the firm for 21 years, after beginning his career in public accounting and later serving as a CFO in the insurance industry. Travis holds both a CPA and Certified Legal Manager designation and has overseen finance, operations, facilities, HR, and marketing as the firm has grown. He is also the immediate past president of the Association of Legal Administrators, the premier international professional association for legal management professionals, and has made mental health and well-being in the legal profession a personal priority. Outside of work, Travis is an avid outdoorsman who enjoys hiking, kayaking, and running, and has completed six marathons.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT LAW FIRM LEADERSHIP AND OPERATIONS

There is someone inside your firm who sees things that may never make it into the managing partner's inbox. They see the operational strain, the succession gaps, and the cultural undercurrents that affect how the firm actually runs. Yet in many law firms, the people managing the business side are still treated as support instead of strategic leadership.

That gap creates real risk. Firms may have plans for transitioning client relationships, but far fewer have thought through what happens when the COO, firm administrator, or another long-tenured business professional leaves. There is also a cost to doing nothing, from attorney time spent figuring out administrative systems to culture problems that quietly affect productivity, retention, and mental health.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Travis Armstrong of English, Lucas, Priest & Owsley about what law firm COOs see that leaders often miss, why operational succession planning matters, how mental health affects the whole firm, and what it means to look at and listen to your culture.

2:33 - How Travis moved from accounting and insurance into legal management

4:34 - Why law firms tend to adopt change more slowly than other industries

5:25 - What the Association of Legal Administrators does for law firm business professionals

10:05 - How managing partners can get more value from their COO or firm administrator

13:14 - How Travis's role evolved from firm administrator to COO as the firm grew

14:17 - Why operational succession planning is a blind spot for law firms

19:00 - The cost of doing nothing when an operational leader retires

21:23 - Why difficult succession conversations are worth having early

23:11 - What the ALA survey revealed about mental health resources in the legal profession

25:16 - Why legal administrative professionals often lack access to the same mental health resources as lawyers

27:45 - How ALA's mental health first aid training helps legal professionals spot warning signs

31:00 - Why law firm leaders need to look honestly at their culture

34:19 - The business case for supporting mental health in law firms

35:25 - Why attorneys need to listen to administrative staff and trust their judgment

Mentioned In What Happens When Lawyers Actually Listen to Their COO

English, Lucas, Priest & Owsley, LLP | LinkedIn

Travis Armstrong on LinkedIn

Association of Legal Administrators

ALA Mental Health First Aid Training

Amanda Koplos | How Legal Administrators Help Unlock Your Law Firm's Potential

Retirement by Design - Ida Abbott Consulting LLC

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Steve Barham is the president and managing shareholder of Chambliss Bahner & Stophel, PC, a law firm based in Chattanooga, Tennessee. A graduate of the University of Virginia School of Law, Steve has practiced in Chattanooga since 1998 and joined Chambliss in 2004. His litigation practice focuses primarily on healthcare and commercial business matters, and he now splits his time between leading the firm and representing clients. Before becoming firm president in 2025, Steve served as the firm's general counsel, advising on ethics, risk management, and professional responsibility. He serves on the Board of Legal Aid of East Tennessee, was appointed by the Tennessee Supreme Court to serve as an interviewer for Tennessee Bar applicants, and helped build the Stophel Scholars Program, an endowment supporting exceptional students at the University of Tennessee at Chattanooga.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT LEADING WITH INTEGRITY AS THE LEGAL PROFESSION CHANGES

Law firm leadership is changing fast, and the pressure is not only coming from technology. New business models, client expectations, and generational shifts are forcing leaders to think carefully about what should change and what should be preserved. Steve Barham's answer is rooted in the values that made the profession worth entering in the first place, including integrity, service, and the lawyer's role as a trusted advisor.

Those values have to show up in the actual work of leading a firm. They shape how leaders work through conflict, how they protect relationships, how they talk to younger lawyers about the future of practice, and how they keep learning instead of assuming they already have the answers. For Steve, leading well means staying open to change without losing sight of the profession's larger obligations to clients, communities, and the rule of law.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge podcast, Elise Holtzman talks with Steve Barham of Chambliss Bahner & Stophel about what is worth preserving in the legal profession, how lawyers can remain trusted advisors as technology changes the work, why service matters to the rule of law, and what it means to lead with integrity when the pressure to compromise is real.

2:32 - Steve's path from firm general counsel to managing shareholder

4:31 - Why interpersonal relationships are the backbone of a law firm

7:46 - Consolidation, technology, and changing client expectations for midsize firms

8:11 - Looking for opportunity instead of reacting from fear

10:08 - Staying focused on client service and relationships

11:00 - Why AI will change the work but not the trusted advisor role

13:12 - Teaching younger lawyers that business development is relationship-based

16:21 - Servant leadership and helping lawyers build careers they are proud of

19:01 - The books shaping Steve's thinking on business development and meaning

21:43 - What it means to maintain law as an honorable profession

27:07 - Walking the talk as a law firm leader

29:33 - Finding meaning outside the law through service

MENTIONED IN LEADING WITH INTEGRITY AS THE LEGAL PROFESSION CHANGES

Chambliss Bahner & Stophel, PC. | LinkedInSteve Barham on LinkedIn

The Activator Advantage

The Meaning of Your Life by Arthur Brooks

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.

Ryan Lockman is the managing partner of Horn Williamson & Collins, a mid-sized construction and commercial litigation law firm in Philadelphia and Delaware. A trial lawyer representing homeowners in residential construction defect and consumer protection disputes throughout Pennsylvania and New Jersey, Ryan has secured more than $20 million in verdicts and arbitration awards, including a $3.2 million jury verdict for homeowners in a construction defect trial. He earned his MBA from the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania, which informs his approach to law firm management, operational efficiency, and long-term strategic growth. Most recently, Ryan developed Construction Defect University, an AI-assisted internal training platform built using Claude Code to provide more structured onboarding and practice-specific training for attorneys and paralegals.

WHAT'S COVERED IN THIS EPISODE ABOUT ATTORNEY TRAINING

Law firms have long relied on observation-based training, with younger lawyers learning by sitting in meetings, listening to experienced attorneys talk through cases, and gradually figuring out how the work gets done. But as Ryan Lockman explains, that kind of ad hoc training only goes so far when new attorneys and paralegals need to understand the terminology, client communication expectations, and litigation process before the work starts to make sense.

At Horn Williamson & Collins, Ryan started addressing that gap by creating more structure inside the firm, including team leaders, internal CLEs, and clearer benchmarks for how attorneys and paralegals should stay on top of cases and communicate with clients. From there, he built Construction Defect University, an AI-assisted internal training platform designed to give new attorneys and paralegals more practice-specific training.

In this episode of The Lawyer's Edge, Elise Holtzman talks with Ryan Lockman about why the old expectation that lawyers should "just figure it out" is breaking down, how structured training supports client service and talent retention, what Construction Defect University actually includes, and how he built it using Claude Code in less than 30 hours.

3:16 - Ryan's path from civil rights law to construction defect litigation

7:00 - How business school changed Ryan's approach to running a law firm

11:15 - Recognizing when an ad hoc training approach no longer works

14:37 - Why "hit the ground running" was never a reasonable expectation

16:23 - The connection between attorney training and talent retention

20:28 - Using incentives to help lawyers understand expectations

23:20 - Training team leaders to manage, mentor, and communicate

27:17 - How Ryan built an AI-assisted internal training platform

29:27 - Internal response to the platform and involving associates in the process

30:46 - What Construction Defect University includes for attorneys and paralegals

36:24 - Using AI as a substitute for hands, not brains

39:21 - Why leaders forget what new lawyers do not know

Mentioned In How One Managing Partner Is Rethinking Attorney Training From the Ground Up

Horn Williamson & Collins | LinkedIn

Ryan Lockman on LinkedIn

Claude Code

Microsoft Copilot

Get connected with the coaching team: hello@thelawyersedge.com

The Lawyer's Edge

SPONSOR FOR THIS EPISODE

This episode is brought to you by the coaching team at The Lawyer's Edge, a training and coaching firm that has been focused exclusively on lawyers and law firms since 2008. Each member of the team is a trained, certified, and experienced professional coach—and either a former practicing attorney or a former law firm marketing and business development professional.

Whatever your professional objectives, our coaches can help you achieve your goals more quickly, more easily, and with significantly less stress. To get connected with your coach, fill out our contact form.